IMO the major damage was done 1979 onwards. Trade Unions have increasingly lost power and thus workers have lost rights. These tinkerings are icing on the cake for the er, boss class. Labour activists have lost influence as the party relies on corporate money and is run by suits. No Debate. Judging by the recent Tory Conference there isn't much debate there either.

the tories never really debate - they just gee each other on as to how far right they can take their policies

Love your anti Tory rants Carnelian, absolutey spot on! Well said!

Agree with all contributors to this thread...I can't wait until those over priveleged bastards are voted out..Labour need to get thier shit together!

We all know that employees' rights caused the global financial meltdown and is now stifling any prospects of growth in the economy, surely? 

 

Plus, it made the tories clap. 

 

 

Agreed on all points. Unfortunately, I think there may be one more coalition. I'm just hoping it's a Lab/Lib/Dem one.

I was rather hoping that the Lib Dems were gonners.

Yes, get right back to the two party dictatorship

It's terribly confusing for the phebs to have too much choice in an election

Well them that can be arsed with voting anyway

 

 

It has always been a two party dictatorship. The only issue I have is that they are becoming rather the same, rather like the pigs and farmers.

"Twelve voices were shouting in anger, and they were all alike. No question, now, what had happened to the faces of the pigs. The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which."

Yes! You win five pounds!

 

Pretty much agree with you. We are undergoing massive restructuring in our business and lots of job losses. The Unions have done absolutely nothing except say "it's all legal what they are doing", thanks unions for nothing.

 

 

As my mate says about politicians, different pigs snuffling same trough. 

Do I detect a touch of  porcine trend mongering.

I've come to the conclusion that all politicians are unreliable, untruthful and untrustworthy. I'm going to deface my ballot paper so it counts as a non vote

Our last MP was too naive to be any of the above.

Have they ever been that different?

The differences were ever simply superficial, the MAN always got paid 

 

The current tory shower and the last sell out socialist mob shows how much of a sh!t they give about us!... It's just a game to them!!<< :inappropriate smiley:

 

 

 

It's a dichotomy isn't it? On one hand we look back and think of the struggle for universal or equal suffrage and conclude that we should use our vote. On the other we require alternative ideology. If no alternative is offered we may wonder whether it's worth bothering.

theyre f*cking awful

trying to clean up the mess left by the last awful f*ckers

If we speak in ideological terms then they were the last f**kers!

Sorry Ensign Muf, but Lib Dems airily putting pegs over their noses and declaring,  'a plague on both your houses', really doesn't cut it anymore!

 

It's not a current Tory shower, it's a coalition shower.  Your lot take the credit for your small victories then you have to take the blame for your enabling of hard right policies. 

 

Most of what the current 'Tory shower' does is rubber-stamped by the Lib Dems, often enthusiastically. 

 

If the Lib Dems were a party of the centre left, they'd boot the likes of Laws out the party. 

 

I find it amazing that the Lib Dems would consider working with a Labour Party it has practically accused of financial treason.  Over the last two years senior "Yellow Book" Lib Dems have spat the type of right wing soundbites, lies and venom at Labour that would make a Daily Mail columnist blush. 

 

Labour and Clegg, Clegg and Labour? Can't see that one!

One hopes not!

You can bash the Lib-Dems all you want Carnie but the fact is that they were always entering any coalition with a pretty ineffectual mandate, so whichever party they picked, they would be co-governing with one arm tied behind their backs.

Party politics has been hijacked by the wealthy and if the electorate wants to do something about it, then it better savvy up and stop being so tribal 

I like tribal. Who knows? Maybe Ed will bring it back later on. I'm not holding my breath though.

I'm not quite sure what you mean.  So in order to get policies that will combat the wealth grab by the wealthy we mustn't be so 'tribal'.  So a consensus right of centre politics will achieve this?  How so?  It's NOT being tribal and following the general Thatcherite consensus that has got us to where we are now and is still making things worse!

 

Let's take privatisation as an example.  The Tories (hugely in favour), Labour (least in favour but still more in favour than not), Yellow Book Lib Dems (very enthusiastic but not as much as the Tories).

 

So being less tribal arrives at a consensus (I'd say a Thatcherite consensus) where we all agree that privatisation is a generally 'good thing'.  Yet privatisation has proven to be a very good wealth grab for the rich. 

My problem with the Lib/Dems is that they agreed to the coalition as the only way to ever have a bit of power. They should have left the Tories to go it alone and see them flounder at every opportunity.

If you think back to just after the last election, the lib-dem/tory or a hung parliament were the only real options. If we had had to have another election, the tories would have won a majority; imagine how bad that would been?!?

I don't think the tories have the balls to take the whole blame for the mess they would and indeed have made and I don't think the socialists had a clue what to do about the mess so it suited them to hide in opposition.

The very worst you can accuse the Lib-dems of being is naive....blah blah, I've lost the will to finish this  

 

Lets just agree that Osborne is an utter t**t who should never have been allowed anywhere near the houses of parliament

We've been hiding in opposition since at least the seventies.

If it's any consolation, the Mail and the Telegraph think 'The Socialists' have Europe in their pockets!  Can't say I've really noticed all the rampant socialism, but they seem to think so.