But Tone was Labour, so thats alright.

Aye.

 

They'd like to bury that one.

Can you justify why Nelson Mandela was a terrorist in a state where 75% of the populace were denied a democratic voice by their white racist overlords?

I dont have to justify it, he just was a terrorist....I suggest you look up the meaning of terrorist, then look back into history as to what Mandela did.

 

If we call Mandela a hero, a freedom fighter, then by that logic Gerry Adams and his merry band of disgusting criminals and murderers are heroes too, then im afraid the world really is mad.

I don't understand all of the fuss here. Mandela, in spite of all the adulation later on, certainly fell within our definition of terrorism. What's your problem?

Furthermore I would suggest that in terms of Foreign Policy Thatcher fell within Napoleon 's definition of "Lucky!" She was lucky. The following PMs must be jealous beyond belief. It's domestic policy that is the issue. She ruined the industrial heartlands. We no longer own our own energy or transport, and of course she is totally to blame for the current economic crisis.

Am way behind in this thread and I see it is not really on topic anymore but to answer your Question Saz it was both..

 

The unions, supported by their workers, priced us out of competitive markets with their constant demands for massive pay increases and striking at any little thing causing production to slow or stop, abusing the very reason unions were set up for in the first place ie to protect workers... and in turn making me hate them, and Scargill in particular, for the constant disruption they caused to many ... including me trying to do my job and making a meagre living compared to the strikers who also mainly lived in areas of the country where the cost of living was/is so much lower so their wages went even further than mine ever did, that is when they actually worked and getting paid and weren't striking,  they were in part the orchestrator's of their own demises because of that. There is only so much money a business can make to pay its workers and grow as well.   The Union leaders were greedy but their members followed them too so they are equally responsible ..  

 

I know it is not as simplistic as that but the late 70's was shite for the rest of us because of the greedy unions and their members who had a choice to say no, enough is enough but didn't..

 

*goes back to page 3 to catch up *

"The rest of us?" We had a lovely time in the seventies. The bit about rubbish being unburied and bodies lying in the streets is in effect an urban myth. A time of absolute certainties. One wonders what future generations will make if the current time.

I just.... I can't even...

you are too cerebral for me GJ .I never understand a word you are saying or to what you are referencing if you are indeed referencing anything anyway. . I am thick innit 

 

tho I did say it wasn't as simplistic as that, nothing ever is, and your answer proves it for me anyway..

 

 

What, is it me? What I said? I can't help feel the way I do about that time.. sorry

 

I don't want to offend others who truly struggled for legit reasons but it seemed all about greed and control [tinged with Red] to me at that time

I'm not cerebral at all. If you notice I avoid a lot of threads like the plague because I don't know stuff. However my second more mature (sic) degree was PPE. "The old certainties!" Is an expression currently in resurgence in the eastern German states. In this country we would probably refer to it as "The Nanny State!" An orderly system of life occurrences watched over by a controlling state. Cradle to the grave. That sort of thing. This new method of selling off everything to individuals who then take their money out of the country displeases me.

I agree with Olly. I too was working in the 70s ( in fact I was working for an electric board , in the offices and on the switchboard ). I saw , and heard first hand the misery striking brought! We had to run night shifts to try and keep people informed which particular hours they were going to be without electricity and when they were hopefully going to be reconnected ! And whether anyone wants ( in the rosy glow of nostalgia) to admit it or not , people at the time were absolutely furious at what the strikers were doing ! The unions shot themselves in the foot with their constant demands That's why Thatcher got in !

I agree, the selling off of public utilities and services was a disaster as they are all profit driven now so the customer comes last. . plus I couldn't even afford to cash in on the free for all buying of shares that was going on at the time..

 

as for you being cerebral I mean that the style you write in goes whooosh over my head cos tis never plain ol English which is about as much as I can understand.. it is flowery and full of stuff I have no clue about.. .I don't even know what a PPE degree is ... 

 

I am sure everyone has their legit reasons for how they feel about those times and I respect them even if I don't always agree. . I was just giving mine. . tbh I was very very very young and immature politically, as well as age wise, back then so probably only concerned with my world and no one else's .. but I can only go with how it all was for me at that time and I do know I ended up hating anything Union related

I can't highlight as I'm on the app....but Lol at the Sun bit Soozy The only paper that crossed our doorstep was the Mirror ....those were the days

It was an exciting time. My Mum and Dad, I think were having WW2 flashbacks. I can remember little light bulbs connected to car batteries, candles in pubs, cinemas, getting me tops, that sort of thing.

(Just got called away) Yes the cinemas were only open certain nights! I think in a fit of solidarity, that any union struggle was our struggle. That's the sort of household I was brought up in. Old Labour and Trade Union activism.

My thoughts go out to the racist Jungle Queen and the criminal Mercenary.

 

I liked this idea, but it is sadly closed now - http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/18914

 

Thatcher state funeral to be privatised

Responsible department: Cabinet Office

 

In keeping with the great lady's legacy, Margaret Thatcher's state funeral should be funded and managed by the private sector to offer the best value and choice for end users and other stakeholders.

The undersigned believe that the legacy of the former PM deserves nothing less and that offering this unique opportunity is an ideal way to cut government expense and further prove the merits of liberalised economics Baroness Thatcher spearheaded.

 

 

Mr Woo nearly killed himself - the shop he worked in was at the end of a block - when next doors electricity was off his was on and vice verca.

 

They used to share electricity for the generator etc through some device - Mr Woo picked up the end of the wire with electricity running through it. It through himacross the yard

 

I remember listening to Capital Radio on the trannie when the TV went off early (it hadn't long been launched and was great publicity for them). The candles, the torches, walking through darkened streets - it was all a bit exciting TBH.

I was brought up in a 'be thankful for what you have' household cos it could be a lot worse. . that was mainly from a Father captured and then chased out of his homeland by a bunch of Nazi's and then not let back  in [well would be let back in but wouldn't be let back out again] for yrs  by a bunch of commies. . but ho hum..

I wonder if we would find it as exciting if it was going on now though....no heating, no lighting , no TV and worst of all , no Internet !

I'm posting blind now! My iPhone won't let me into the thread no more.

Was it? hours spent struggling to get to work cos when the leccy went off so did the points on the train lines, then work a full day mainly in the dark and cold then struggling to get back home again, and repeat until you were so exhausted you didn't know if you were coming or going .. yeah those were the days ... them there unions made it so much fun for us all.. wooohoo 

Same here GJ.... I've had to switch to the lappy Maybe the app is on strike

That's how I remember it too.....

But people talked to each other - it was like a communal 'let's get on with it' type thing. I was a teenager - I really didn't mind working a three day week TBH I expect there were people who were really inconvenienced by it all - my recollection of it was something a bit different from the every day mundane stuff.

 Soozy...... but maybe our recollections are a *generational thing*......I was in my mid 20s when the worst of the strikes were going on, and to me it certainly wasn't fun

Glad you had fun Soozy.. I was a teenager too.. I worked in a bank ..yeah I know oh the horror.. but it was a proper bank back then, on a high street where you did all your finances F2F and nothing was centralised, it was all done at high street level.. you cashed your cheques and paid your bills etc as well as the other stuff we did behind the scenes like debt and business management and lots lots more .. there was no three day week for us.. and people were too damn pissed off and tired to talk to each other on the long long trips to and from work.. so no, not a exciting time for us.. 

 Indeed.

I'm sure it was a generational thing - although I was a teen - I was working but it was only a bus ride or bit longer walk away - I had no responsibilities - it was all a bit of a lark. I'm sure 'older' people or those whose life was really inconvenienced have different recollections.

 

I think you're from round 'my way' when I was younger Baz - I was working at the time at Lombards (quite a famous building - landmark roundabout on the Purley Way) do you know it? It's not been Lombards for years now but it's still called Lombard Roundabout - not far from Reeves Corner which burnt down in the riots.

Thats why I detest Blair. They shared similar views, but at least Mrs Thatcher had the honesty and integrity to do it within the Conservative party. Blair should have joined the Conservatives. Not create a non-party like New Labour which just dressed up Mrs Thatchers policies in a load of PR bull. Then throw in a lot of nebulous half baked policies based on PR focus groups and "targets" to create the impression they were doing something. 

I think historian David Starkey described New Labour as actually not a party at all, it was a sort of con trick / pretend party, with no solid ideology at all. 

Mrs Thatcher stood up for what she believed in and there was blessedly little double dealing. At least her actions were driven by intellectual rigour and ideology. It was just vanity and self interest on Blair's part... and he spawned a whole lot of them who don't give a damn about the country, and will foul up politics for years to come 

This never fails to make me shudder TBH.

 

Sorry - can't help it - it just sprung to mind.

 

I was about 20 miles further south Soozy But my first husbands family were nearer you , and I do vaguely remember Lombards . Was it a bank , insurance building ? And defo remember Purley Way Although by the 70s I was married and had moved even further south  

Rosie ....I couldn't agree more

 Baz lol... never thought I'd end up defending Mrs T...

 

 

No, Gerry Adams had the vote and could stand for office, as could every single person of republican sentiment in NI at the time.  If the majority of Northern Irish really wanted to leave the UK, the British gov't would have let them go, just as they let the south go.

So does my Mum

 Me neither Rosie

Good idea.