which when you think about it is also odd from her point of view!  It definitely comes across as it all being about him, but strange that the night before Valentine's day she wants to go home.  Maybe the speech the next morning was on her mind [funny giving a speech on DV on the supposed most romantic day of the year] 

the more I think about it, the more I believe either it was a sham relationship set up to raise both their profiles and she was about to leave it putting any future deals for OP at risk or she worked out they had nothing in common and he's a selfish, self-centred oik and she wanted out but he felt threatened 

I was Rog, I was referring to Pengy's suggestion that it was a sham relatinship and she wanted to leave it. 

FWIW, I think Reeva had fallen for Oscar but she had niggling doubts about his moods and temper. 

soooooooooooo

we know she wasn't staying on the 13th, she wanted to go home and finish her speech for the girls she was addressing the next morning in Johannesburg, so it makes sense she would want to be there for that.

He told her about the sh*tty thing and asked her to stay, she never replied and told him to continue with his plans with his family. yet he still wanted her there even though she said she wanted to be away for 6 o'clock.

Twice in evidence he changed his mind halfway through his testimony... OP's own words,

Twice he nearly said when you come to bed!  Also, I do believe she did eat a snack much later, 8 hours for that amount of food to be still in her stomach is ridiculous, I don't think she went to bed. I believe there was one almighty row and I believe he was on his prosthesis. He said in testimony he was on his knees in the hallway outside the door, I believe at that point he had his prosthesis on when he fired, only he was on his knees.

I believe the four witnesses that heard 4 bangs/shots at three and then more at around 3.17.

I also don't trust anyone that was in that house that morning, who took OP's phone home, why did Aimee Pistorious and Standlers daughter take Reeve's handbag, why did she go in the safe , did she take the watch because it was broken? That would explain the blood on the outside and inside of the box! If anyone tampered with evidence or moved stuff it was his family and friends!

The blood droplets on the duvet, the fans not plugged in where he said they were, out on the balcony and then he didn't go out on the balcony. I for one don't believe a single word out of his mouth, I have loads more...just give me time to think 

I think the same Yogi and I think with his insistence she stayed the night to pacify him and something set him off 

It's possible but if I am going to convict him of murder I need to be convinced that the argument took place and Oscar knowingly shot at the door intending to kill Reeva - otherwise I am sticking with CH of a person who was behind the bathroom door.

Not sure what I think about Aimee, as she didn't take the stand, it is hard to make a judgement about what she did or didn't do. I'm sure the State would have called her if they had evidence of any wrongdoing.

From everything I heard in court, I would say the SA police are inept and probably corrupt, so I can believe it is possible that the watches were stolen by one of them.

 Poor Aimee!  She can't do right for doing wrong!!! 

Kitchen GBH again? With her previous it doesn't look good for her   

Even if his story was to believed, he could still be found guilty of murder Yogi. He was under no threat...and if he were to be believed the only threat was in is mind and I don't believe he suffers from Gad. I thinks he's as nervous as most people in SA, his security was not what you would expect from someone who is paranoid. 

Didn't know if the alarms were working, didn't know if Reeva knew how to work them. That alone is telling, she either knew how to work them or they were not switched on when she used a key to get into his house. Broken window downstairs, dogs that were dumb apparently and balcony windows open when he went to bed 

There was a friend from Uni staying and there was Frank...don't believe a word of him been scared for his luff 

But, if that were the case, why did she have a Valentine's card for him, in which she had written, I think now might be the day to tell you I love you - or words to that effect? 

I was Rog, I was referring to Pengy's suggestion that it was a sham relatinship and she wanted to leave it. 

FWIW, I think Reeva had fallen for Oscar but she had niggling doubts about his moods and temper. 

first time that word was spoken Yogi and to be fair, it you're in a relationship you're obligated in a way, to buy a card & pressie and say I love you (even if you don't) except OP didn't get the message the selfish git.  I'm wholeheartedly convinced she wasn't in love with him.  I think this domestic violence talk had brought to her forefront possible signs of him starting down that route and she wanted out.

I'm not sure I believe him either. He lied about the lesser charges which makes me think he is lying about a lot of other stuff too. 

I think some of his texts to Reeva and some evidence heard in court did show a heightened perception of crime, but not completely paranoid about it.

it's just been posited [oooo get me]  around the net that it may not have been a proper relationship.  Personally I think she probably initially really liked him but then he wore her down which didn't seem to take long considering they were only in a relationship for a couple of months 

I think most would have a heightened perception of crime Yogi...I think Mr Mikey said they sleep with the bedroom doors locked too...well someone did. I truly do not think he's paranoid and doesn't socialize  I think there is plenty of evidence to the contrary to be honest  

Pengy, you might feel obliged to buy a Valentine card but I don't think you actually write the words 'I think now might be the day to tell you I love you', if you are thinking of leaving someone.

Where do they get these theories from? 

I think there is an awful lot of conjecture and hypotheses doing the rounds and tbh I think some folks need to rein it in. Some people just like making up carp!

Not meaning you, Pengy. 

I think there is plenty of evidence that he socialised but that doesn't mean he doesn't have a heightened perception of crime - it certainly wasn't to a degree where he stayed barricaded in his home, afraid to go out.

I know there's lots of carp out there and I think I can tell the difference by now from the ridiculous hypothesis

Personally I will only read the information from blogs like Charl du Plessis, David Dadiac and some of the law experts on the Oscar channel199 - they give a balanced, objective view plus they have the advantage of being either lawyers or ex lawyers so I feel their input is valid  

Where do they get these theories from? 

I think there is an awful lot of conjecture and hypotheses doing the rounds and tbh I think some folks need to rein it in. Some people just like making up carp!

Not meaning you, Pengy. 

I hope I didn't give the impression I doubt your judgement or ability to sift through the carp. I'm just getting annoyed that some people are making up stuff now, with no real basis for it. It seems to have gone far beyond speculating, based on evidence given in court.

I just think he feels the same like most South Africans Yogi, I think the two sessions with Dr Vorster were pretty pointless and so biased the report wasn't worth the paper it was typed on  I'm sure Oldage will be pointing him the right direction on what to answer 

Oh and I don't for one minute think they were in love, like Pengy I think she was going with the flow, I'm sure the first flush was wearing off and I don't for one minute think he loved her and never have, there is absolutely no evidence to show it. There is however plenty of evidence to say that she was worried about his reactions to certain things. 

don't be daft woman   there are a lot of backroom lawyers like her dameship those over on the other place do get carried away with speculating.  Thing is sometimes through all that speculating you do get an alternative point of view and sometimes it makes a lot of sense so I don't dismiss them out of hand but when ever I quote stuff it's always from the 'experts' that I quoted  

don't be daft woman   there are a lot of backroom lawyers like her dameship those over on the other place do get carried away with speculating.  Thing is sometimes through all that speculating you do get an alternative point of view and sometimes it makes a lot of sense so I don't dismiss them out of hand but when ever I quote stuff it's always from the 'experts' that I quoted  

I lot of it I dismiss...like the second lot of mobile phones post, when he filled in the gaps with the extra's  I do sift through it though and if you read through it, it proves Reeva was not asleep and neither was OP  Its just making sense of the facts and ignoring all other things, like I said IMO I believe there was a row, I don't believe Reeva was in bead and I believe she had a snack at the time OP's phone went on at 1am..but they are facts apart from the row. Although I didn't doubt the first witnesses for one minute and Roux gave her a bloody hard time and more or less accused her of telling lies. 

I think both lawyers are doing what they are paid to do and I do think Nel is far sharper than Roux and with so much conflicting statements from OP you can't really blame him for not giving a grand performance and Nel does have much more experience. 

I was with Roux on her testimony.

I think both lawyers are doing what they are paid to do and I do think Nel is far sharper than Roux and with so much conflicting statements from OP you can't really blame him for not giving a grand performance and Nel does have much more experience. 

 I wasn't  Sift through the other witnesses evidence and it exactly matches her version....approx 2.58 the raised voices and the first four bangs...much like what others have said 

Nah, I can't be ars bothered to get my notebook out again, but she was the least convincing witness for the state, imo. Too rehearsed, too precise with no room for doubt, and didn't come forward for ages - after lots of detail had already been in the press. She lied to fit the state's case, I tell thee!

I agree with all of this - I'm not saying Roux is a bad lawyer but defence have only to prove a slight doubt and given the money OP has paid, I'm not sure Roux or Oldage has given him enough bang for his buck   If I was OP I'd be a bit ticked at the defence although part of the problem is his own testimony 

Nel may grandstand a bit but he's razor sharp and as he says, is the voice of the victim   

I love Barry's norty school boy look and Nel's sucking of his glasses - now if I could get a combination of the two I'd be happy 

I agree with all of this - I'm not saying Roux is a bad lawyer but defence have only to prove a slight doubt and given the money OP has paid, I'm not sure Roux or Oldage has given him enough bang for his buck   If I was OP I'd be a bit ticked at the defence although part of the problem is his own testimony 

Nel may grandstand a bit but he's razor sharp and as he says, is the voice of the victim   

I love Barry's norty school boy look and Nel's sucking of his glasses - now if I could get a combination of the two I'd be happy 

bit like the h'aaaaartbroken probation officer 

bit like the h'aaaaartbroken probation officer 

Maybe because she was the one that was wide awake Yogi 

I did laugh at her and thought that was one idea that Roux should have shelved 

I think a huge part of the problem was Oscar's testimony. He refused to accept responsibility for any of the lesser charges and blatantly lied, which cast serious doubt on everything else he said. He also seemed to deviate from the defence strategy/version of events which created big problems for Roux.