Would a major factor not be whether or not you are Roman Catholics if you have a choice of just two schools?  If you are Catholics, then presumably you would want to send your daughter to a faith school, but if you are not Catholics, then you wouldn't want her to go to a faith school. 

Hi Growly, we aren't Roman Catholic, she has been to the local catholic junior school. This was a small local school and had good ofsted reports. It's because she's been here that we have two choices, otherwise it would be the sports college/school or nowt.

Did your daughter have an opinion?
Sometimes our children have a gut feeling which would be best, word of mouth, friends etc.

thanks Crossy, sadly her opinion is usually based on the opinion of the last person she spoke to.

OK I just wondered. Hope you get the right place.

I've just come back from an open morning with my son...personally I'd always make sure I see the school in daytime to get a true picture of what its really like...and if you are looking at results check the Value Added element first of all.

Catholic schools are normally oversubscribed and they usually demand a signature from a priest to say that you attend Mass every week. Is this not the case in your area?

If you are not to worried about exam results, I would visit the schools during normal school days and judge them on how happy the pupils seem and how well disciplined they seem.

If you can, try and talk to as many of the teachers as possible. At the end of the day they are the ones that really matter.

From what you've said, I'd think it'd be no competition. Go for the RC school. Better to pushed a bit, that would be my thinking.

Sports, your daughter can do outside of school anyway if she really wants to.

See I'd go the other way cos the RC schools results are slipping which would indicate there's something wrong there whereas the other schools results are coming up which means they are doing things right and are making improvements.

I don't understand why you would want to send your daughter to a Roman Catholic school if you are not Catholics. 

Yes, but it's a sports college. I'm not interested in how much better they've got at pole vaulting this year.

 The RC still has better results so I'd go with them. The other is improving, but still not as good. I am biased however, half my family are teachers in RC schools.

Sports colleges do everything other schools don't, they just have better sport facilities...when they're used!

I'll go along with the query of why would you send a non-RC to an RC school?  *baffled smilie*

I'm assuming because they have better results.

Even non-Catholic Catholics want to send their kids to RC schools.

A pupil of my mother's, a few years ago, her whole family converted from Jewdaism to get their kids into the local catholic primary.

But why?  Isn't it rather hypocritical?  It's like people who aren't religious having a church wedding.

I think that's really disgusting.  I have no problem with anyone converting to any religion at any time in their lives if they realise that they want to follow that faith, but to change faiths to get their child into a particular school is breathtakingly hypocritical.

I suppose it depends on how inportant you religion is to you. Obviously, for them it mattered less than their child's education.

They have good reputations, mostly for discipline.

In my case, my two eldest kids were already attending the RC school, when I lost my faith. Should I have moved them away from all their friends and sent them to the school with a fairly low reputation?

Then I had to decide whether to send my youngest two to the other school, or give them the same chances my eldest two had.

Not easy decisions, so I decided on being a pretendy Catholic, until they had all finished school.

I don't think it's a question of whether religion matters more or less than education.  In my case, had I decided to go to church for a few months and pretended to be a Christian, I could have got my daughter into one of the best performing infant schools for miles around.  But I am an atheist, not a Christian, and have enough respect for other people's religions not to be hypocritical, and to effectively cheat to get a place for my child, and to deprive another parent of a place at a school designed to educate children of their own faith.  I also don't think it would have set a very good example to my daughter to show her that it's possible to get what you want by dishonesty.  I can't think of many things in my life which I have taken more seriously than my daughter's education, but I could never have gone against my principles and lied to get her into the best local school.  I think it woudl have been immoral.


Blizzie, I think your case is rather different and quite unusual.  You said that you lost your faith whilst your children were already at the school, which implies that you were a Roman Catholic when they started, so no, in that case, I don't think you should have taken them away when your religious views changed.

Hi thanks for the time you've all put in to this.
I will just explain the Catholic part from my position here. We are christians, protestants by baptism, and confirmation of myself. The local schools are not oversubscribed and if she went to the Catholic school she would not deprive a RC pupil of a place there.
I think christian teaching is absolutely fine in our position, and my daughter is a kind caring and polite child, she enjoys religious lessons.
There is not a church of Enland high school in our area.

Hi croc, can you give me a simple explanation at all what the Value Added element means?

Hi Low

I went through this last year with my youngest.   We kinda went with his opinion of the schools (but was a bit easier.. cos he didn't want to go to the school partnered with his primary school.... so no friends influencing him).

We put down four choices... apart form the main school he DIDN't want... they were the four closest to our home (one closer that the school he is allocated to by default... which is actually against all the education authority rules n stuff)....

Anyway.. long story short... we didn't get any of the four choices, they didn't give us the local one... they allocated him to the worst school in the region... in the middle of a very rough estate, surrounded by drug den flats, needles, (I have seen this school.... the mums don't wear shoes at the primary school gates which is  next door)....  Wormwood Scrubs is looking good compared to this place.

We then had to embark on 4 appeals... 4 separate appeals, cos it is done from a schools perspective, not the kids.   Luckily after having to attend only 5 evening hearings... we got a tip off from his teacher, that there was a lovely school across the county border with space... and we got him in there.

What I am saying is... be careful with your choices... the reality often is there is NO choice... just a process that leads you to believe there is.   Cover your self and make sure you put your local school on your options.

Good Luck   (it took us til mid summer to get this all sorted... really stressful)

Getting my son a crash course baptism & confirmation did cross my mind....

In our area, the RC School is pretty good, had it been an option for us (hubby is catholic, the kids n I aren't) I would have put it down as a choice.

basically its what the school adds to a child education...one school might get better results cos the intake is at a higher level to start with but the school down the road may get lower achievers in general and may add more to the education but bringing them up more levels.

Say school a 's intake are mostly level 5 at KS2 sats and then level 7 at KeyStage 3 but school b's intake is mainly level 4's and they are also at level 7 in KS3 then they have added more and so would indicate more effective teaching methods in the seconds school.

Have a look here and there's a bit more info.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Pa...n_Learning_Franchise

hi ditty, eeh that sounds a right performance.
I'm hoping to get our first choice, cos round here they're not full. We are lucky to have a choice of the Catholic school. Admittance there is in order of preference - RC's first, then attendance at our local Catholic junior school. Lots of kids aren't Catholics that go here. Most of the kids from my daughter's class will go to the sports school as it's in our town, the Catholic school is in the next town and cost more in bus fares. I think one of my daughter's friends may be go to RC school. When we chose the RC junior school no other kids transferred there with her.  After the first term about 3 kids from her previous school came into her class, cos of bullying at the next door juniors. I will never be a sheep and just send her with the rest, just for the sake of it.

  I read that in True Yorkshire!

I have to go pick my boy up from his now... but just wanted to say...

you're right about the sheep thing.... schools get a word of mouth reputation... but in my experience it tends to be out of date....

oh, and a lot of my daughters friends made their choices because of where there friends were going.... by xmas none of them hung around together anyway.  (one girl turned down a grammar place, because she wanted to be with her friend!!!   Happily, she has just transferred to the grammar now for 6th form.... she got Ickles place

Croc, thanks appreciated, I will go and read it

and the boys did good last night, shouted me ed off

The well being of the whole child is of paramount importance. Some children flourish in highly populated schools while others would do better at a smaller school. You need to understand your own child's needs .; That is more important than any Ofsted report!

A RC school would not insist that a non-RC attend mass just as A Christian based school would not insist That a RC attend any faith assemble.
Personally I think that like the French schools Religion should play no part in the national curriculum...... leave that to the parents!

I'm surprised your looking at performance tables etc . .  and not at  "knowing my daughter as a person, wot wud she prefer?" Sorry if i'm reading this wrong.

My main concern wud be .... can the school offer your daughter the specialist support she needs? Nothing else

Renton, yes you're right i am looking for how a school can support my daughter the best. I am doing background research first ie. reading the reports. I am going to visit both schools, and that is what I am asking for help with really. What to look for at the school, and what probing questions to ask. maybe some peeps have experience in this, and may have thought "i wish I'd noticed that , or asked that" when they've visited a prospective school.

Figtree, yes I do get all that. I just want to find a good way of checking which school will be best suited for her needs.

Are you thinking about sending her out of town Low, there's an excellent one where the Roman Catholic one is just outside of town. Don't know if you could get her in there, is this for next year? I've got to dash out now, interested to know which two schools you're looking at...

Oh blimey I went through this dilemma last year aswell. We're RC and my son is RC (although not practising). I desperately wanted him to go to a good RC school that I knew would be really difficult to get him into. But I knew it was a good school and really like their ethics and knew they pushed the kids in areas they knew they had talent or showed interest. He wanted to go to the local dump where kids are just sent for convenience.

We fought for bloody ages over it. Initially he didn't get offered a place in the RC school, instead he got the local dump. He thought great I thought bollocks. But accepted the dump cos I had to.

Pleaded with the RC school and was on the waiting list, got a call to say a place had become available but they needed to know within 24 hrs as there were 300 kids behind him on the waiting list. We argued again that night but ended with the compromise that he would give it a 3 month trial and if he hated it he could go to the dump.

Touch wood he seems to like it. It's a hike to get there but I'm already impressed with the place, plus they have a system I can log into to see how he's doing daily (teachers uploads behaviour reports, attendance records etc). I'm hoping that he'll stay, a lot of people have said 'you're the parent, he shouldn't have a choice' but I disagree. If he's happy he'll learn. If he's not he wont, no matter how good the place is, so to me, it's imperative things like this are discussed, and mutually beneficial resolutions and compromises are reached.


Jesus I cant half bloody drone on.

You do right Low.... glean information from every source you can find... and doing it before the visits is a really good idea (oops... I didn't LOL... I did it AFTER the visits).

Its like Karma just said... you have to work with them to come to the right decision ....   cos left just to the kid, they will make the wrong decision, cos of where their friends are going.... so you have to balance it with a bit of parenting.  Tis what we do!

Also...  you're lucky if all the schools have places.... it means that your options are still open should she not like the school once she starts.

Thanks Karma for sharing that. You have also given me a question to ask on my visit about the online info for parents about child's progress, that sounds such a good idea.