quote:

Originally posted by Liverpoollass:

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Originally posted by squiggle:
Since this thread is about Margaret Thatcher and people have been blaming her for all the ills of the modern world, she'll probably get blamed for swine flu any minute, I would just like to remind people of Gorbachev Reagan and Thatcher who brought an end to communism in Russia and lead directly to an end to the Cold War and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Unfortunately, that makes no difference because Maggie haters have selective memories. They hate her and that is it

Hyacinth, totally agree with you.

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:


Oh and yes, where were you when I needed you last night?

I had to do battle on my own

What can I say?

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Garage Joe:

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Originally posted by squiggle:
Since this thread is about Margaret Thatcher and people have been blaming her for all the ills of the modern world, she'll probably get blamed for swine flu any minute, I would just like to remind people of Gorbachev Reagan and Thatcher who brought an end to communism in Russia and lead directly to an end to the Cold War and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

This seems like a good time to air the old question,

Q. "What's the difference between Capitalism and Communism?"

A. "In Capitalism, man exploits man, but in Communism it's the other way around!"

So really with your way of thinking there was no point in ending the Cold War, reuniting Germany and bringing down the Berlin Wall then. Just same old same old according to you then?

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Originally posted by rusticana:

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Maggie had one very fatal flaw in her philosophy - She couldn't distinguish the difference between wealth creation and wealth aquisition. That is why this country lost the majority of it's wealth creation industry and replaced it with wealth aquisistion IE Banking, Insurance, service industries all dependent on taking in one another's washing. It was an accident waiting to happen since the eighties.

People forget that the current situation with MP's expenses rest firmly at her door. She introduced the second home allowance to compensate for the lack of a salary increase. MP's were encouraged to treat this allowance as part of their salary and therefore it is not suprising that they did - hence the outrageous claims.


So it's her fault that the greedy MP's do not have an ounce of decency or a moral compass?


And if it was her fault then why was she and her husband not doing the same? Helping themselves to public funds, nor Harold Wilson or any other leader before Tony Blair?

How do you know that she wasn't - the expenses scandal only deals with claims over the past four/five years. We do not know what was going on before that.

I worked for a company once where instead of a pay rise it was agreed that I could fill my car with fuel once a week. If you had come accross that situation a few years later and not understood the agreement it would have looked as though I was stealing company fuel. That is what happened to the MP's - they were told they could claim upto £23K and treat it as salary - thats what most have done !!!

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Originally posted by Garage Joe:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Garage Joe:

quote:

Originally posted by squiggle:
Since this thread is about Margaret Thatcher and people have been blaming her for all the ills of the modern world, she'll probably get blamed for swine flu any minute, I would just like to remind people of Gorbachev Reagan and Thatcher who brought an end to communism in Russia and lead directly to an end to the Cold War and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

This seems like a good time to air the old question,

Q. "What's the difference between Capitalism and Communism?"

A. "In Capitalism, man exploits man, but in Communism it's the other way around!"

So really with your way of thinking there was no point in ending the Cold War, reuniting Germany and bringing down the Berlin Wall then. Just same old same old according to you then?

An interesting interpretation of my post on your part.

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Originally posted by Mentalist:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:


Oh and yes, where were you when I needed you last night?

I had to do battle on my own

What can I say?

Can I pinch this, I'm always having to say sorry for something?

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Originally posted by squiggle:

One thing, I have a very clear memory of those times. Her and Dennis used to have very modest holidays and so did the Wilsons. Mostly they holidayed in this country. She bought her own property in Dulwich. This 'freebie' culture of holidays for free and in great style started with the Blairs and Peter Mandelson was sacked how many times for dubious deals and crooked mortgages? Also how many properties do the Blairs own nowadays. Believe me this corruption on a grand scale is a very recent phenomenon and of course the Kinnocks are 2 others who have always lived very high on the hog whilst draining the life blood out of the working people of this country.

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Originally posted by squiggle:
Believe me this corruption on a grand scale is a very recent phenomenon .

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So it's her fault that the greedy MP's do not have an ounce of decency or a moral compass?

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:

quote:

Originally posted by squiggle:
Since this thread is about Margaret Thatcher and people have been blaming her for all the ills of the modern world, she'll probably get blamed for swine flu any minute, I would just like to remind people of Gorbachev Reagan and Thatcher who brought an end to communism in Russia and lead directly to an end to the Cold War and the fall of the Berlin Wall.

Unfortunately, that makes no difference because Maggie haters have selective memories. They hate her and that is it

Hyacinth, totally agree with you.

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but certain union leaders allowed power to go to their heads and forgot about the needs of their members.

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Originally posted by squiggle:

Do you know LL and Hy I am proud to be a member of the (admittedly small) group who have defended Lady Thatcher on this thread. As you have both said it is just contemptible to wait like vultures for the death of an old lady who may have had her faults but loved this country and did a job which needed doing, and that was curbing the power of the unions. As I have said in my posts before unions were the saviour of the working man and woman in this country but certain union leaders allowed power to go to their heads and forgot about the needs of their members. Somebody had to stand up to them and unfortunately that job fell to Margaret Thatcher and she will be hated for it evermore.

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Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:

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but certain union leaders allowed power to go to their heads and forgot about the needs of their members.

Now substitute elected members for union leaders, and constituents for members..

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

Do you know LL and Hy I am proud to be a member of the (admittedly small) group who have defended Lady Thatcher on this thread. As you have both said it is just contemptible to wait like vultures for the death of an old lady who may have had her faults but loved this country and did a job which needed doing, and that was curbing the power of the unions. As I have said in my posts before unions were the saviour of the working man and woman in this country but certain union leaders allowed power to go to their heads and forgot about the needs of their members. Somebody had to stand up to them and unfortunately that job fell to Margaret Thatcher and she will be hated for it evermore.

l'm just glad I am not alone anymore

Yeah, I am proud too but we are fighting a losing battle I am afraid. Still, it has been a reasonably good debate and so far no-one has resorted to fisticuffs

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Mentalist:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:


Oh and yes, where were you when I needed you last night?

I had to do battle on my own

What can I say?

Can I pinch this, I'm always having to say sorry for something?

You're very welcome. Photobucket is great for smilies if you put into the search box what sort of smiley you're after.

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so far no-one has resorted to fisticuffs

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Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:
In part, I'd say so.. her policies and their implementation ( by the Tories, and by New Labour after them..) led to a real sea-change in how people operate and view things. We moved away from a sense of collective responsibility and social justice to a culture where the individual and his/ her interests is paramount, where greed is rewarded , where ruthlessness was seen as a positive trait.. so yeh, there's influence there I think.

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Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:
I like your wee fighty people LL

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Didn't this start in the late 1950s? The Long Sixties (1957-1973) produced all sorts of counter-cultural things in various places. The civil rights movements, the sexual revolution, an experiemental drugs culture, self-enlightenment, a very distinct music and fashion scene, quasi-religious cults, [...], and phrases like "do your own thing" and the fanmous "turn on, tune in, drop out"? It was a new age of personal freedom

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

Do you know LL and Hy I am proud to be a member of the (admittedly small) group who have defended Lady Thatcher on this thread. As you have both said it is just contemptible to wait like vultures for the death of an old lady who may have had her faults but loved this country and did a job which needed doing, and that was curbing the power of the unions. As I have said in my posts before unions were the saviour of the working man and woman in this country but certain union leaders allowed power to go to their heads and forgot about the needs of their members. Somebody had to stand up to them and unfortunately that job fell to Margaret Thatcher and she will be hated for it evermore.

l'm just glad I am not alone anymore

Yeah, I am proud too but we are fighting a losing battle I am afraid. Still, it has been a reasonably good debate and so far no-one has resorted to fisticuffs

Yes we have tried to state our case. I know it will fall on deaf ears but hey ho, I'm off to have a cuppa

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Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:

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Didn't this start in the late 1950s? The Long Sixties (1957-1973) produced all sorts of counter-cultural things in various places. The civil rights movements, the sexual revolution, an experiemental drugs culture, self-enlightenment, a very distinct music and fashion scene, quasi-religious cults, [...], and phrases like "do your own thing" and the fanmous "turn on, tune in, drop out"? It was a new age of personal freedom

I'm thinking more of the growth of the new managerialist approach , the " businessfication" of what were previously services etc..

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Originally posted by Mentalist:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Mentalist:

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Liverpoollass:


Oh and yes, where were you when I needed you last night?

I had to do battle on my own

What can I say?

Can I pinch this, I'm always having to say sorry for something?

You're very welcome. Photobucket is great for smilies if you put into the search box what sort of smiley you're after.

I went to photobucket but how do you get the smiley, do you down load it to your computer and store it in a file?

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:


Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

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Originally posted by The Singing Ringing Tree:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

I am sure there is a Cliff Richard joke in there some where

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

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Originally posted by The Singing Ringing Tree:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

I am sure there is a Cliff Richard joke in there some where

I bloody love the Cliff! I base my life upon his teachings I have someone locked up in a trunk in my bedsit, so no big hunk can steal him away from meeeeee

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Originally posted by Garage Joe:
One notices that, at the bottom of the page, there is a box advertising Chat for the over 50s, what's that all about then?

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Originally posted by squiggle:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

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Originally posted by The Singing Ringing Tree:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

I am sure there is a Cliff Richard joke in there some where

I bloody love the Cliff! I base my life upon his teachings I have someone locked up in a trunk in my bedsit, so no big hunk can steal him away from meeeeee

Tiptoes quietly away from the thread

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

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Originally posted by The Singing Ringing Tree:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

Plus the fact that opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one

I am sure there is a Cliff Richard joke in there some where

I bloody love the Cliff! I base my life upon his teachings I have someone locked up in a trunk in my bedsit, so no big hunk can steal him away from meeeeee

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Originally posted by Daniel J*:
She has Alzeimers, hasn't she? I suppose if you wanted to be cruel, you could tell her she was a life-long Marxist.

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Originally posted by Mazzystar:
How ironic that the old bat who sought to divide and conquer the unions and working classes is still polarising opinions!

Loathe the woman and all she stands for,but I still love you LL!

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:

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Originally posted by ~Orchid~:

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Originally posted by Ennis Del Beadle:
oh bollocks! I thought this was a death announcement! I was just about to crack out the champagne even though i hate the stuff!

you are evilllllllll

Not at all! I hate the woman for trying to destroy the working classes and indirectly putting us in the position we are in now...That is not to say that our current government is not culpable...

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Originally posted by Dame_Ann_Average:
I would just like to say I have not got selective memory about the Thatcher years, and whilst some people may have come out well, some towns were devastated by her policies and goverment. I watched my home town, and many around us simply thrown onto the scrap heap and have never recovered. Mine after mine were closed down, the Steel industry ground to a stand still and smaller companies feeding off those simply go under. from a thriving town, we now have nothing, no jobs, no industries and very little wealth. I don't wish her dead, I don't want to dance on her grave, but I do wish she had never come to power. If that's selective memory, I'm reminded of it everyday when I walk out of my front door. Empty factories, closed shops and very little else. Am I bitter yes, but in truth, that's my memory of the Thatcher years!

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Originally posted by faerykelstar:
Mark Thomas has an interesting approach to the Thatcher funeral policy. http://www.markthomasinfo.com/...updates/thatcher.asp