quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Turkey Choker:
Make of it all what you will, but there is still a little girl missing, presumed dead (I don't want to even contemplate the worse case scenario) because of the negligence of her supposedly educated middle class parents.
They are responsible for that little girls disappearance whichever way you slice it!

The person(s) who took her is responsible.

What person is that ?

Do you have evidence there was an abduction ?

What I have is common sense, and the ability to form a rational opinion based on reason and probability.

So that being the case you dismiss all the evidence in favour of emotion.

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Turkey Choker:
Make of it all what you will, but there is still a little girl missing, presumed dead (I don't want to even contemplate the worse case scenario) because of the negligence of her supposedly educated middle class parents.
They are responsible for that little girls disappearance whichever way you slice it!

The person(s) who took her is responsible.

What person is that ?

Do you have evidence there was an abduction ?

What I have is common sense, and the ability to form a rational opinion based on reason and probability.

So that being the case you dismiss all the evidence in favour of emotion.

No.

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:
I really cant understand at all how anyone can think the mcanns had anythink to do with madeline going missing.Im 100% sure the only thing they did wrong was leave her

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Turkey Choker:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Turkey Choker:
Make of it all what you will, but there is still a little girl missing, presumed dead (I don't want to even contemplate the worse case scenario) because of the negligence of her supposedly educated middle class parents.
They are responsible for that little girls disappearance whichever way you slice it!

The person(s) who took her is responsible.

Yes he/she is, but if they had been responsible parents, they would never have left 3 under 5's alone in an apartment while they went out. Did they not even consider the fact that they may get up and injure themselves? Not even considering abduction?

Sickening in my opinion....Oh and btw, I do love the idea of your quiz, wherever did you get the idea?

Indeed - it was irresponsible of them to leave their children unattended, that doesn’t excuse in any way someone taking Madeleine.

Virtually every forum you visit has a fun trivia link, did you think it was a wee secret

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:
I really cant understand at all how anyone can think the mcanns had anythink to do with madeline going missing.Im 100% sure the only thing they did wrong was leave her

Perhaps it is due to the fact that the evidence suggests so... http://blip.tv/file/2036418

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:
I really cant understand at all how anyone can think the mcanns had anythink to do with madeline going missing.Im 100% sure the only thing they did wrong was leave her

Perhaps it is due to the fact that the evidence suggests so... http://blip.tv/file/2036418

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by JasmineJ:

quote:

Originally posted by Turkey Choker:
Make of it all what you will, but there is still a little girl missing, presumed dead (I don't want to even contemplate the worse case scenario) because of the negligence of her supposedly educated middle class parents.
They are responsible for that little girls disappearance whichever way you slice it!

The person(s) who took her is responsible.

What person is that ?

Do you have evidence there was an abduction ?

quote:

Portuguese police had hoped to stage a reconstruction of the events surrounding Madeleine’s disappearance tomorrow. However, they have been forced to abandon the re-enactment after some of the McCanns friends said they could not see the value in returning to Portugal to take part.

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:
I really cant understand at all how anyone can think the mcanns had anythink to do with madeline going missing.Im 100% sure the only thing they did wrong was leave her

Perhaps it is due to the fact that the evidence suggests so... http://blip.tv/file/2036418

why do you keep posting that link?......................it's so incredibly biased and much of that evidence (so called) has been disproved. Perhaps you should extend your reading .........concentrating on one biased source doesn't really allow you to open your mind.

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...e/article4022991.ece

quote:

Portuguese police had hoped to stage a reconstruction of the events surrounding Madeleine’s disappearance tomorrow. However, they have been forced to abandon the re-enactment after some of the McCanns friends said they could not see the value in returning to Portugal to take part.

Still as unwilling to co-operate with official investigation then.

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:
I really cant understand at all how anyone can think the mcanns had anythink to do with madeline going missing.Im 100% sure the only thing they did wrong was leave her

Perhaps it is due to the fact that the evidence suggests so... http://blip.tv/file/2036418

why do you keep posting that link?......................it's so incredibly biased and much of that evidence (so called) has been disproved. Perhaps you should extend your reading .........concentrating on one biased source doesn't really allow you to open your mind.

Were the dogs corrupt ?

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...e/article4022991.ece

quote:

Portuguese police had hoped to stage a reconstruction of the events surrounding Madeleine’s disappearance tomorrow. However, they have been forced to abandon the re-enactment after some of the McCanns friends said they could not see the value in returning to Portugal to take part.

Still as unwilling to co-operate with official investigation then.

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

quote:

The employees of the Tapas Bar, according to what 24 Horas discovered, guaranteed to the inspectors of the PJ that Jane Tanner was always in the restaurant and that only O'Brien and Gerry McCann and his wife Kate were absent during dinner. O'Brien has never entered in the flat where Maddie slept with the twins as this is stated in the deposition that he gave to the authorities. Jane Tanner only left the restaurant when Kate appeared screaming: They've taken her.

quote:

Originally posted by Supercalifragilistic:
Let me make it clear that I have a completely open mind about the cause of her 'disappearance'....but can't imagine they took their work gear on their hol's????

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Supercalifragilistic:
Let me make it clear that I have a completely open mind about the cause of her 'disappearance'....but can't imagine they took their work gear on their hol's????

Just can't imagine the likes of the McCanns with their jobs and financial means wouldn't have different hol/work clothes????


Well I've gone on me hols with shoes or a skirt I've worn for work.................underwear even - TBH this whole dog thing has taken on a life of it's own - nothing can be proven but .......a handbag/pen/shoes .....the faintest trace is apparently detectable.

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

I no longer have the resources to a link but an independent lab proved that the so called blood link to Madeleine and the McCanns was discounted

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
it's such a shame that they didn't put the same fervour and effort into finding Madeliene that they diod into trying to prove that the parents were guilty.

quote:

Originally posted by Penny Gabrielwise:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
it's such a shame that they didn't put the same fervour and effort into finding Madeliene that they diod into trying to prove that the parents were guilty.

And on which dodgy disproved links do you base that?

Sorry, works both ways.

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
you dont have to be Einstein to link some things together do you?

quote:

Originally posted by Penny Gabrielwise:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
you dont have to be Einstein to link some things together do you?

I think it depends on which national press one reads, and that ultimately nobody has a clue what happened to that girl other than those who took part in whatever it was that they did to her.

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
As an aside ...........how wonderful that we have been able to debate this for 38 pages without it being pulled

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

I no longer have the resources to a link but an independent lab proved that the so called blood link to Madeleine and the McCanns was discounted

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Penny Gabrielwise:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:
you dont have to be Einstein to link some things together do you?

I think it depends on which national press one reads, and that ultimately nobody has a clue what happened to that girl other than those who took part in whatever it was that they did to her.

Nothing to do with the national press. When the case was closed the files were released ..........three independent witnesses spoke of a man stalking and eyeing up the apartments. Why on earth was that never made public?

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:
Re Dogs picking up on scents etc. I watch an Australian airport programme about Passport Control and boy are the Aussie's strict and observant about who and what is coming into their country. They use dogs to sniff out drugs in luggage and when the dogs give a positive signal that person is pulled over for questioning, they're questioned, searched and taken to hospital via the police for internal examinations if it's felt necessary. What I've learnt overtime from watching many programmes is yes a dog can identify the scent of drugs - as they're trained to, other dogs are trained to identify blood - but luggage can show positive reactions to drugs if it's been in proximity to it from other sources and not necessarily from the owner of the luggage. So dogs can be right in their scenting but wrong in their assumption of who's responsible for the scent

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

I no longer have the resources to a link but an independent lab proved that the so called blood link to Madeleine and the McCanns was discounted

Exactly .........it would seem our Comrade has not read around the subject and chooses to base his/her suspicions on one dodgy disproved link.

If there'd been a shred of evidence - no matter how small the Mc Canns would have been charged .......the Portuguese Police were desperate ........it's such a shame that they didn't put the same fervour and effort into finding Madeliene that they diod into trying to prove that the parents were guilty.

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

I no longer have the resources to a link but an independent lab proved that the so called blood link to Madeleine and the McCanns was discounted

Exactly .........it would seem our Comrade has not read around the subject and chooses to base his/her suspicions on one dodgy disproved link.

If there'd been a shred of evidence - no matter how small the Mc Canns would have been charged .......the Portuguese Police were desperate ........it's such a shame that they didn't put the same fervour and effort into finding Madeliene that they diod into trying to prove that the parents were guilty.

I agree Soozy, I really cannot believe that some people think the McCann's are responsible for their daughter's disappearance, it beggars belief for me

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:
Re Dogs picking up on scents etc. I watch an Australian airport programme about Passport Control and boy are the Aussie's strict and observant about who and what is coming into their country. They use dogs to sniff out drugs in luggage and when the dogs give a positive signal that person is pulled over for questioning, they're questioned, searched and taken to hospital via the police for internal examinations if it's felt necessary. What I've learnt overtime from watching many programmes is yes a dog can identify the scent of drugs - as they're trained to, other dogs are trained to identify blood - but luggage can show positive reactions to drugs if it's been in proximity to it from other sources and not necessarily from the owner of the luggage. So dogs can be right in their scenting but wrong in their assumption of who's responsible for the scent

How would that explain the cadaver scent ?

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:
Re Dogs picking up on scents etc. I watch an Australian airport programme about Passport Control and boy are the Aussie's strict and observant about who and what is coming into their country. They use dogs to sniff out drugs in luggage and when the dogs give a positive signal that person is pulled over for questioning, they're questioned, searched and taken to hospital via the police for internal examinations if it's felt necessary. What I've learnt overtime from watching many programmes is yes a dog can identify the scent of drugs - as they're trained to, other dogs are trained to identify blood - but luggage can show positive reactions to drugs if it's been in proximity to it from other sources and not necessarily from the owner of the luggage. So dogs can be right in their scenting but wrong in their assumption of who's responsible for the scent

How would that explain the cadaver scent ?

Animals have instincts that most humans don't, how do we know if they differentiate between the death of one species or another. In a nutshell I still don't see why some believe the McCann's are involved

quote:

Originally posted by Shar:
I do think the suggestion that the Portugese police and authorities are inferior to their British counterparts is highly insulting ...

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:
Re Dogs picking up on scents etc. I watch an Australian airport programme about Passport Control and boy are the Aussie's strict and observant about who and what is coming into their country. They use dogs to sniff out drugs in luggage and when the dogs give a positive signal that person is pulled over for questioning, they're questioned, searched and taken to hospital via the police for internal examinations if it's felt necessary. What I've learnt overtime from watching many programmes is yes a dog can identify the scent of drugs - as they're trained to, other dogs are trained to identify blood - but luggage can show positive reactions to drugs if it's been in proximity to it from other sources and not necessarily from the owner of the luggage. So dogs can be right in their scenting but wrong in their assumption of who's responsible for the scent

How would that explain the cadaver scent ?

Animals have instincts that most humans don't, how do we know if they differentiate between the death of one species or another. In a nutshell I still don't see why some believe the McCann's are involved

The well-trained cadaver dog is an outstanding tool for crime scene investigation displaying excellent sensitivity (75-100), specificity (91-100), and having a positive predictive value (90-100), negative predictive value (90-100) as well as accuracy (92-100).

Reference:
Cadaver dogs–a study on detection of contaminated carpet squares.
Oesterhelweg L, Kröber S, Rottmann K, Willhöft J, Braun C, Thies N, Püschel K, Silkenath J, Gehl A.
Institute of Legal Medicine, University Medical Center Hamburg, Germany

The McCanns tried one judge in their favour:
The Eugene Zapata Case

In this case there was no blood though. Additionally Eddie indicated at several places.


The judge agreed with an analysis of the three dogs’ track record by Zapata’s defence team that found they were incorrect 78 per cent, 71 per cent and 62 per cent of the time.

Since Eddie indicated SEVERAL times 6 as far as I know, even by the worst number 78% he would have had a chance of roughly 22% to be wrong 6 times.

If you take the worst case numbers in the research paper scenario around 10% wrong, the chances of him detecting 6 times wrong would be 0.0001%.

Additional to that you have the handlers opinion..

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Soozy woo:

quote:

Originally posted by Yellow Rose:

quote:

Originally posted by Comrade Ogilvy:

quote:

Originally posted by ilovewillyoung:

quote:

Were the dogs corrupt ?

Oh for Gods sake

Any story needs to satisfactorily explain why the dogs indicated and there was blood and body fluid. Everything else is emotional conjecture.

I no longer have the resources to a link but an independent lab proved that the so called blood link to Madeleine and the McCanns was discounted

Exactly .........it would seem our Comrade has not read around the subject and chooses to base his/her suspicions on one dodgy disproved link.

If there'd been a shred of evidence - no matter how small the Mc Canns would have been charged .......the Portuguese Police were desperate ........it's such a shame that they didn't put the same fervour and effort into finding Madeliene that they diod into trying to prove that the parents were guilty.

I agree Soozy, I really cannot believe that some people think the McCann's are responsible for their daughter's disappearance, it beggars belief for me

Yep ............me too. The thing is until she is found or ............a body there will always
be divided opinion on this.

To me ....it's conclusive proof that the McCanns are innocent in that they've never failed to stop trying to raise the profile on Madelienes dissapearance ............if they'd have had anything at all to hide they would have slunk off home .....laid low and let the dust seetle.

i have asked Comrade Ogilvy his opinion on this three maybe four times .........he simply refuses to answer.

To me ....it simply proves that they are parents who made a stupid mistake and it has ruined their lives and ....................god only knows what to their daughter.

Some people thrive on a bit of scandal or a good conspiracy theory...........I've never understood that.

my heart goes out to the Mc Canns and dear little Madeliene.