Miss Piggy is the ultimate woman - strong, dramatic , knows what she wants. Josie does have some of those tendencies... BUT JJ Kermit??
Kermit is witty,urbane and funny.
JJ is a twat

No, we have her word and Mario's word.

And I agree, she is more forgiving than I would be.

Would you go up to someone you'd just met and call them Miss Piggy?

We don't know what they said, Who knows who's right? My money is on Sam.

Why Cologne? Why don't you think believe Josie?

Forgiving my butt Blizz....Her reaction to Caoimhe with JJ was wow,and understandable yes....What Sam is alleged to have done,how deeply he upset her etc and overnight,literally overnight she loves him....Nope it don't make sense and it's not about forgiveness..... Caoimhe was wrong but in comparison to what Sam is supposed to have done there is no comparison,

I haven't heard Sam deny it.

Or, are you saying he was right to say those things?

No, but as I've said before. Sam doesn't do it with malicious intent. He's clever, but immature, and naive.

But he's stopped behaving like that and is being nice to everyone now.
She's been told not to mention what happened in lockdown anymore, so she's just got to get on with it and try to see his nicer side.

Because she's a tramp. She never tells the truths, she walks around acting, sucking her thumb because she thinks it's endearing, she's boring, boring, boring. She lobbyed against Sunshine and Keeva, she now thinks the house is her domain. Can't stand her, Sorry.

I wouldn't call it clever, at all. I'm surprised he's got any front teeth left, to be honest.
His friend on BBLB, said that he also told one of his other friend's girlfriends that she was a pig, but they seemed to find it amusing.

I'll agree with the immature and naive!

Maybe if you stopped thinking she was lying and acting all the time, you'd realise that you are totally misjudging her.

And, again, what lobbying did she do against Sunshine?

And again it's assumption ,assumption that's why she's done a complete turnaround and now loves him,she suddenly saw his nicer side when her and JJ got the answers they wanted when they questioned him on Friday night...I could understand her *Tolerating* him not her turnaround,it defy's belief.

Oh so naivety is the excuse for being rude and personal is it?

Sorry Prom -he knows EXACTLY what he is doing...
He is a nasty little worm -  no better than JJ.

That's a little harsh.
Keeva could give as good as she gets...
I didn't see any evidence of her lobbying against Sunshine,

As for sucking her thumb - thats a nasty habit but it hardly makes her a tramp.

He's  very clever, he's just not socially aware, at all. In ten years time he'll look back on things he's done and feel embarassed and probably ashamed. He's still a kid in many ways. But he has a 'don't give a shit' attitude that we've never ever seen on BB and I don't mean the pathetic braindead arguments we saw from Charley etc he's the real deal.

I hope he wins just for that.

Blizz it is possible you could have misjudged her,I did....Let's be honest none of us know these folk,well I don't think we do,so we cannot say for certain and  vehemently deny or fiercely  defend someone we don't know,well imo any road.

Of course it's possible, but we're all judging on what we see in the house and most of the stuff I see written about Joise is quite ridiculous, tbh.

As I said, if she argues with someone, she trying to get them nominated, and if she gets on with someone, she's trying to avoid nominations.

If you assume that someone is acting, then everything they then do appears to be suspect.

True and Keeylee never said anything nasty about him, in fact she made a point of really liking him. Who is right and who is  wrong?

Sorry we will have to agree to disagree.
He wins - he will NEVER learn anything,..
What's the word? Humility. Sam needs a little of that. He wins BB then he will see it as his behaviour being right and he will always be a twat.

And I have quoted you twice..

I'd say he behaved in a very similar fashion to the likes of Charley, at first, but I really do think he gives a shit and has calmed down considerably since.

If my nine year old son behaved like that, he'd soon know how clever I thought he was being!

Maybe he wasn't rude to Keeley?
Maybe she didn't hear his abusive remarks?
Maybe she finds it funny?

Sorry Lee I missed this post somehow. Yes, she's painfully transparent. One eye on the mag deals and the other on the money. She realised JJ was claiming to like Sam and hey presto suddenly she can see his nice side when she hated him the day before. Yeah, that's 'real' isn't it? Her BB showmance was in danger, she cleverly averted the danger by lying through her teeth.

Sam is only a young kid who follows his gut instict. He is insulting, but also takes insults back. I really don't think he's the devil incarnate.

I did like her Blizz but then as time has gone on have noticed too many negative things about her....I take them all at face value,form my opinion on how they are in the house,hearsay and anything outside the house plays no part,nor do skeletons in their closets...You may find the things written about her ridiculous,I think most FM's could say the same about their chosen HM, but  that's not to say they're incorrect....Unless it were one of my own children in there,my kids who I know inside out I couldn't and wouldn't try to defend or assume a HM is all they claim to be/not be.

My feelings exactly!

I hope it galvanises her to be a bit more hygenic, the posts on DS are not very complementary.

Haven't read all the replies. Sam has quiented down last few days cos as he's said he doesn't want to go his first week. Even if he was nominated doubt the public would choose him as many seem to see him see him as a saviour of the show. I like Josie and think he was awful to her for several days, she seems to have forgiven him or seen another side so even if she could nominate him maybe she wouldn't now

I'm not expecting everyone to like her, Lee.

But assuming she is acting and lying for that many weeks, is just ridiculously cynical, and ends up with her character being completely assassinated in every situation.

I didn't like Ben, because I didn't like Ben, but i didn't need to think he was not being himself to do that!

Prom that just nailed it for me tbh....Other things I've overlooked or though Hmmm maybe and gave the benefit of the doubt,the turnaround no...I'm a forgiving person,to a fault sometimes tbh,but that is just too much to swallow as being genuine imo,I'd say it's impossible really.

I agree with all you say YR. The other thing is, which people seem to forget is that they are in a confined space - they almost have to get on with each other.
Were they not in the house, Sam would not have got away with his behaviour.
They are nothing more than lab rats really and we the viewers judge their behaviour accordingly.

No, they are disgusting.

If you think she's acting and after mag deals, do you really think she would discuss her minge, at all?

But you're willing to accept his turnaround as genuine?

It's called being human. I can sort of see why she did it. I think she just wants the nastiness to stop.
Josie jokes a lot to hide her feelings.... a lot of us do that. We say things are alright when clearly they are not.

Has he turned around?,I hadn't even noticed tbh.

Or suck her thumb all the time, or wear a mismatch of clothes?
I am with you Blizzie - but we are in the minority sadly.

From where I'm sitting Josie was complicit in the isolation of Sunshine amongst the girls , she was complicit in JJ's attack on Corin which she grinned through in the garden, and she instigated the isolation of Keeva - all with JJ as the common denominator.

We don't actually know that any of this is true.

Isa I know all about being human,trust me on that,I am also an expert at saying things are alright when in reality the walls are tumbling down around me but even I would find it utterly impossible to go from hating someone to loving them in 24 hours...Tolerate them yes,be civil yes,love them,not a bluddy chance.