Skip to main content

Replies sorted oldest to newest

Reference:ding dong
Yes I think most people have read it however he made some fundamental errors. The animals were not well looked after and they did not kill the farmer and his wife.
They were initially..and yeah they ousted the farmer, but he was getting the Russian Revolution facts mixed up with the literature. I'm not even going to defend him, but I don't think he was that way off and he was explaining it to someone who wasn't aware of it...kinda like how I'd explain it to my kids who have no historical context to the story.
suzybean
Reference:
But George Orwell, himself, used the 'natural hierarchy' described in the book to show how closely linked Socialism was to National Socialism (Nazis) so Ben's interpretation is a valid one.
Really I thought it was Marxism and not Socialism. 

He was making a case for a dictator of dictators who control there "sheep" I think he said.
DING DONG! THE WITCH IS DEAD.
Reference suzybean Today at 22:02:
He described the premise of Animal Farm pretty accurately IMO. It's a secondary school book anyhow, I'm sure lots of people have read it.
He made some very basic mistakes.

He said the animals were treated well by the farmer - wrong.

He said the animals killed the farmer and his wife - wrong.

He said the bigger animals eventually gained power over the smaller ones -wrong. The pigs took control (the largest and most physically-powerful animals in the book were the horses, Boxer and Clover).


Ben was essentially implying that the animals had been better off under the farmer, which wasn't Orwell's intention at all - as the ending makes clear, he was showing that there was no difference.
Eugene's Lair
Reference:
He made some very basic mistakes. He said the animals were treated well by the farmer - wrong. He said the animals killed the farmer and his wife - wrong. He said the bigger animals eventually gained power over the smaller ones -wrong. The pigs took control (the largest and most physically-powerful animals in the book were the horses, Boxer and Clover). Ben was essentially implying that the animals had been better off under the farmer, which wasn't Orwell's intention at all - as the ending makes clear, he was showing that there was no difference.

Agree very much. 
DING DONG! THE WITCH IS DEAD.
I thought that one of the points of Animal Farm was that power corrupts, ie the pigs who had the power owing to being able to read and write, used that power to change things and eventually there was no difference between them and the humans (who were originally the enemy) not (as ben was implying) that natural hierarchies 'take care'  of lesser mortals, In animal farm they totally stuffed the lesser mortals to get comforts for themselves. As always happens. As was Orwell's point.


Poor daft ben. All that education and still thick as 2 short planks.
J
Reference:
Yes eugene, but I heard him say the animals all ate under the farmer's rule (they did) and you are correct the 'cleverest' animals (pigs) did take over, but he had already just said that he views intelligence/knowledge as strength so I still don't see that he is completely off the mark. He was telling JJ not the Exam Board.

No the farmer forgot to feed and take care of them as he was drunk.

The biggest animals where used buy the pigs and eventually sold the the glue factory

I accept he was telling JJ and not the exam board but he told it his way to suit a very dodgy society he wants to live in.
DING DONG! THE WITCH IS DEAD.
Reference:
I thought that one of the points of Animal Farm was that power corrupts, ie the pigs who had the power owing to being able to read and write, used that power to change things and eventually there was no difference between them and the humans (who were originally the enemy) not (as ben was implying) that natural hierarchies 'take care' of lesser mortals, In animal farm they totally stuffed the lesser mortals to get comforts for themselves. As always happens. As was Orwell's point.
Now thats how i remember it, but i suppose it depends on your English teacher
Moonbeams
Reference:ding dong
I accept he was telling JJ and not the exam board but he told it his way to suit a very dodgy society he wants to live in.
That's just it, he'd already declared his position as a 'Feudal Paternalist' so he's bound to seek justification in everything he sees or reads...just like how the Bible is interpreted in a multitude of ways. Whether I agree with him or not, he did have the grace to declare his agenda.
suzybean
Reference suzybean Today at 22:13:
Yes eugene, but I heard him say the animals all ate under the farmer's rule (they did) and you are correct the 'cleverest' animals (pigs) did take over, but he had already just said that he views intelligence/knowledge as strength so I still don't see that he is completely off the mark. He was telling JJ not the Exam Board.
I would still say that his central point was still wrong, though. He was implying that the animals were better-off under the farmer (Czar) than under animal rule (Communism). However I would suggest the famous ending makes it clear that Orwell thought they were both as bad as each other:
"The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again: but already it was impossible to say which was which."
Eugene's Lair
Reference:
That's just it, he'd already declared his position as a 'Feudal Paternalist' so he's bound to seek justification in everything he sees or reads...just like how the Bible is interpreted in a multitude of ways. Whether I agree with him or not, he did have the grace to declare his agenda.
So we Agree? I am sorry If you did not pick up the sarcasm in the title of the thread.
DING DONG! THE WITCH IS DEAD.
Reference:
I accept he was telling JJ and not the exam board but he told it his way to suit a very dodgy society he wants to live in. That's just it, he'd already declared his position as a 'Feudal Paternalist' so he's bound to seek justification in everything he sees or reads...just like how the Bible is interpreted in a multitude of ways. Whether I agree with him or not, he did have the grace to declare his agenda.
Bo**ocks, he's just talking how he sees it. Actually, for a Tory boy, being brought up in preppy school, he is very thoughtful of other people's feelings, he should be hoovering them all up and be top dog if he was really the upper class knob that some make him out to be.
cologne 1
Reference:
I would still say that his central point was still wrong, though. He was implying that the animals were better-off under the farmer (Czar) than under animal rule (Communism). However I would suggest the famous ending makes it clear that Orwell thought they were both as bad as each other: "The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again: but already it was impossible to say which was which."
The farmer got drunk and neglected the animals. at the end its just the same. the Czar and with his aristocracy  and the President and his Party are just the same.
DING DONG! THE WITCH IS DEAD.

Add Reply

×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×