They are all champions because they are all better than Liverpool and Man City. One of whom cannot believe they are not champions and the other who have to spend a great deal of money in the hope of becoming champions.

Does that help?

The title Champions League implies you have to be champions to be  in it at all. Chelsea (yes), Man U, Arsenal and Spurs, NIL PWAH!

So even Accrington Stanley are champions too then?

Yes.
And Scunthorpe and also Lancing Rangers under 8's.

I don't know.

But if and when you find out the answer could you let us all know please? Muchly thankings.

I think it's just historical. The predecessor of the Champions League was popularly known as the European Cup, but was properly called the "European Champion Clubs' Cup", and you did originally have to be national champions to take part.

I think originally the expansion to allow lower-ranked teams was largely to pacify countries like England, Italy and Spain who were miffed that they (whose clubs, coincidentally, bring in most of the advertising revenue) didn't get more representation than the "smaller" footballing powers. However, I've suspected for a while that current structure is an attempt to create a European league by the back-door...

Thanks Karma. You put a lot of effort into that 

Well exactly, originally it was a champions league. Ironically European Cup is now a more fitting description. I think they're kind of confused really. Or just a bit thick.

I had to google for ideas

I'm going with capitalism.  Or capitulation.  One of them two. 

I personally suspect delusions of grandeur.
Mind you, the problem with "European Cup" is that it sounds as if it's more appropriate for (and could be mistaken for) what is known as the European Nations Cup (think World Cup...)

They've got to call it something. And what they do call it is wrong on both counts because not only does it not just have champions but for most of its phases it doesn't have what you'd think of as a 'league'.  For most of its phases it's a knock out competition like the World Cup, which also has a group stage and knock out rounds.

It used to be the European Cup and then UEFA decided that they could have more big clubs playing more lucrative matches in a group stage, so presumably re-branded it as "The Champions League".

It has exactly the same set-up as the World Cup though, more or less. It's a cup competition with a league 'qualifying' stage. So European Cup is as close as we're going to get to what it actually is. Well, they can't call it what it 'actually' is. Who would be interested in the Not Champions At All League?

Capitalism it is then. They only want fringe teams in it because it generates more revenue. I bet even you are amazed that you sussed it out unwittingly 

England are quite good you know. No-one EVER talks about England in these football thingies Pedants

Staggered.  I just had my dictionary open at c-words and stuck a pin in. 

No, we're not. We really aren't 

Mystic bat nearly has a sort of ring to it?

Not quite the same as the World Cup as the World Cup doesn't have a knock out phase prior to the group phase to ensure almost all the small teams from smaller countries (champions or not) get dumped out before the lucrative group stage.

Then the big rich clubs join in with a drawn out group stage to maximise the numbers of games played, before reverting back to a knock out competition for the latter rounds.

Yet Spurs still wormed their way in. Amazing really, you can't get much smaller than Spurs really.

You know what I mean!

They could in theory have the group phase earlier on and have bigger groups and less rounds, but for some reason the group phase kicks in when most of the European big boys are seeded to enter.

I suspect they live in fear of cup shocks. They would rather see Man U v Barcelona than Zilina v Spartak Moscow 

tbf, who wouldn't?  I mean, I know the answer to that, but as a somewhat non-partisan enjoyer of football I just want to see the best players and teams match up.  The standard of games in Europe now pisses all over 90% of what was on offer before.

You really would be amazed at how many people wouldn't. My team (Chelsea) has so many supporters who don't give a flying for the CL all they are worried about is petty domestic arguments with Arsenal, Spurs etc. They want to win the PL for bragging rights.

I am in a minority as a lifelong Chelsea supporter. I'd spit on most so-called Chelsea 'fans' these days. Sorry that was a bit random

Not at all.  I wouldn't be amazed in the least. 

I realise most supporters just want to see their own team win whatever competition they deem most important at that time and really wouldn't care if it was victorious via the efforts of the skeletal remains of Acrington Stanley on a ,mud bath with added sleet.

Just not my thing.  I like great football.  Best team wins I'm good with it.

I like what's best as possible in life.  Tribal trivialities that stifle that are tedious.


I realise I'm odd. 

If that makes you odd we're two of a kind. Beating the best of Europe v doing a Rangers/Celtic with Man U for another season isn't my idea of 'challenging'

Hmmm most Chelsea fans I know have been involved with the club from day dot. As their parents were, relatives etc. I'd go as far to say that it's probably the only club I know that has such a family following (but then I am in West London - might be different elsewhere).

EDIT: I'll try and re-word that. I mean in terms of London supporters, Chelsea appears to have more of a family/generation following.

It's probably an internet thing. If you go on the 'official' Chelsea Chat site most of them have never even been to London or even England. I realise it's not like that in the real world. I suppose what I am trying to say is the internet is evil. Yes, yes that's it.

All sorts of complex reasons are involved. I agree that the best competition consisted of the winners entering a knock-out competition whilst the First Division (in old money) continued to play 42 games mostly on a Saturday at 3pm.
At some point the people who wish to make the most money decided  that we should have a pan European competition cosisting of all the best European teams........ and Paris St Germain. To get people used to this idea they brought in a Champion's league system with more teams in the hope that they would eventually arrive at an exclusively Euro season long competition. Alas! (Tee-Hee) It's all gone tits up. Everyone is in debt, and would you really want to miss winter games and local derbies?

Yes.

The football available to see is (almost) uniformly better.  People remember the classic match ups from yonder year fondly....and forget all the dross.

I support neither team particularly but Barcelona versus Arsenal at the Emirates year after year?  Oh yes.

But what happens when one of 'em goes through a bad patch as  they will eventually. (Actually I can't remember Arsenal going through a bad patch but you know what I mean)