A lot of former Labour voters have defected to UKIP too.

 

I hear them ringing LBC radio in their droves.

Vids you been in the wrong threads  its mentalists' heaven!

But my point is that perhaps if people were * allowed* to voice their concerns about aspects of immigration without being labelled racist these parties wouldn't have such a following 

 

 

I'm not not saying any different am I? 

I bet it's the last posts those mentalists ever do on there tho.

Well if it's any consolation we kicked their arses in the top right, but due to the EC's ridiculous PR rules (irony) they won one of our seats.
We aren't big fans of the extreme right up here.

You only mentioned BNP people defecting to Ukip, no mention of Labour voters in your last post.

 

 

I think people do, its talked about freely. I don't label anyone racist for having concerns Baz  What I detest most are some of the things that have been said openly by mainly extreme right wing groups/ candidates and Councillors  

Being against the EU is thought of as being "extreme right" now.?

No! They're usually not funny anyway.

 

 

not as many as the Tories, but seen has the Tories and Labour do not hold extreme views on racism as far as I'm aware I didn't see its relevance Whereas BNP are and have defected to UKIP 

There's a bit more to UKIP than being anti-Europe.

Pity the EU didn't  simply stay as the /a Common Market ....which is what we voted for in the first place ....not the United States of Europe ....that's where it all went wrong IMO 

I've gotta go guys, but I'll just say this, im sick of this nonsense that everyone who has anything to do with UKIP as being "extreme right wing" or just nasty people, and everyone who is pro EU who thinks mass open door immigration is wonderful as the lovely people...neither is true. 

 

Lets be able to debate this subject without the labels.

 

Nanight everyone.

They get a few posts in, build up a head of steam then pouf! Inactive  

 

  

Nite Video  

Nanight Vids  Nanight everyone 

 

 

night Rosie 

Nite nite Rosie

UKIP attract extremely right wing people. There is plenty of evidence all across the net to prove it. The rest of their supporters suffer from lazy political analysis.

Nite nite Rosie  

sweeping

Is your name Lorry - heh heh 

Got no answer to that one, eh?

 

*swings pants*

Indeed.

 

Some might say that was a lazy analysis to those who vote UKIP, if in doubt diminish them as people and their opinions...so I guess all the intelligent people hate UKIP and are pro EU...that's the end of that debate then.

 

 

The relevance is that you only want to point out some (if any) BNP bozo's that might have defected to UKIP, but you don't want to mention that lovely cuddly lefty Labour people have also defected over to UKIP, as well as Tories of course.

 

So people from all political backgrounds and ideas have joined UKIP, so to only point out that BNP idiots who may have joined up really isn't an accurate portrayal of UKIP as a party....so my point is relevant.

 

Fair play, if you don't agree with UKIP then don't vote for them, but don't demonise them and rubbish them and their supporters simply because of a few bad apples...who BTW were booted out of the party straight away and were old Tories.

 

Tell me, would you prefer if UKIP and all Euro skeptic political party's didn't exist and that the only party's we could vote for were all Euro friendly and for there to be no choice at all.?

That isn't what they are saying, either you don't understand what they are saying, or you are choosing to mis- represent it, and thereby choosing to be insulted,I've noticed the victim trait a fair bit from UKIP supporters.

 

I don't think all UKIP supporters are racists and I really don't see Farage as racist, but  several UKIP members  do their best by tweeting stupid things to promote the racist perception they have gained.

 

Pirate , you may not buy the protest vote thing, but it is certainly a fact, I know several people that voted UKIP in the Euro ballot because they are angry at the status quo,they have all said it was a one off and they won't be doing it again.

 

 

True, misogynistic for starters.

 

How can any party in the developed world think that stopping maternity payments and maternity leave, is a good idea?

 

It reeks of 'women should be at home looking after their man'

 

I'm not overly convinced of their 31% flat tax rate either...Rich get richer and the poor get poorer.....

 

 

The relevance is that in my opinions the other main parties do not have a influx of BNP ex members joining their party, I am not for one minute suggesting that the protest voters are racist, that is why I never mentioned them and why if you are going to bring up another party why just mention Labour and not the Conservitives and the Libdems...who I also missed out? 

 

I don't mind Euro skeptical parties, what I do mind and find disgusting is remarks made by more than a few bad apples!

 

 

Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first. ~Charles de Gaulle

 

 

 

 

I completely agree with this. .Only just started reading this thread so the debate may have moved on. .

 

I have to say the people I see associating themselves with UKIP are the sort of people that haven't moved with the times and accepted multiculturalism and use words that with most normal people have thankfully disappeared from the vocabulary. It scares me to think that UKIP have done so well... I actually cannot see any difference between them and the BNP except they aren't so obvious with their brand of racism.. Nigel Farage strikes me as a right dodgy geezer too.. He reminds me of people I would disassociate myself from because they are backward thinkers and closet racists as well a homophobes... UKIP have no policies other than the Immigration and EU one...    scary prospect

 

 

Mind you if he wants to bring back smoking in pubs [maybe a dedicated area] that's fine by me but not a reason to vote for them

 

I'm also for reassessing our Membership of the EU but again not a reason to vote UKIP

What did the EEC/EU ever do for us? Not much, apart from: providing 57% of our trade; structural funding to areas hit by industrial decline; clean beaches and rivers; cleaner air; lead free petrol; restrictions on landfill dumping; a recycling culture; cheaper mobile charges; cheaper air travel; improved consumer protection and food labelling; a ban on growth hormones and other harmful food additives; better product safety; single market competition bringing quality improvements and better industrial performance; break up of monopolies; Europe-wide patent and copyright protection; no paperwork or customs for exports throughout the single market; price transparency and removal of commission on currency exchanges across the eurozone; freedom to travel, live and work across Europe; funded opportunities for young people to undertake study or work placements abroad; access to European health services; labour protection and enhanced social welfare; smoke-free workplaces; equal pay legislation; holiday entitlement; the right not to work more than a 48-hour week without overtime; strongest wildlife protection in the world; improved animal welfare in food production; EU-funded research and industrial collaboration; EU representation in international forums; bloc EEA negotiation at the WTO; EU diplomatic efforts to uphold the nuclear non-proliferation treaty; European arrest warrant; cross border policing to combat human trafficking, arms and drug smuggling; counter terrorism intelligence; European civil and military co-operation in post-conflict zones in Europe and Africa; support for democracy and human rights across Europe and beyond; investment across Europe contributing to better living standards and educational, social and cultural capital.All of this is nothing compared with its greatest achievements: the EU has for 60 years been the foundation of peace between European neighbours after centuries of bloodshed. It furthermore assisted the extraordinary political, social and economic transformation of 13 former dictatorships, now EU members, since 1980. Now the union faces major challenges brought on by neoliberal economic globalisation, and worsened by its own systemic weaknesses. It is taking measures to overcome these. We in the UK should reflect on whether our net contribution of £7bn out of total government expenditure of £695bn is good value. We must play a full part in enabling the union to be a force for good in a multipolar global future.
All of this is nothing compared with its greatest achievements: the EU has for 60 years been the foundation of peace between European neighbours after centuries of bloodshed. It furthermore assisted the extraordinary political, social and economic transformation of 13 former dictatorships, now EU members, since 1980. Now the union faces major challenges brought on by neoliberal economic globalisation, and worsened by its own systemic weaknesses. It is taking measures to overcome these. We in the UK should reflect on whether our net contribution of £7bn out of total government expenditure of £695bn is good value. We must play a full part in enabling the union to be a force for good in a multipolar global future.All of this is nothing compared with its greatest achievements: the EU has for 60 years been the foundation of peace between European neighbours after centuries of bloodshed. It furthermore assisted the extraordinary political, social and economic transformation of 13 former dictatorships, now EU members, since 1980. Now the union faces major challenges brought on by neoliberal economic globalisation, and worsened by its own systemic weaknesses. It is taking measures to overcome these. We in the UK should reflect on whether our net contribution of £7bn out of total government expenditure of £695bn is good value. We must play a full part in enabling the union to be a force for good in a multipolar global future.
(Letters to t'Grauniad)
Simon Sweeney lecturer in IP York University.

Like that gadjie in the Life of Brian, isn't it though?

I agree with this too

 

It's like UKIP are the more 'acceptable' arm of the BNP..

 

 

But they are 'allowed' to and not shouted down.. .

 

Everyone, I think, agrees that we are overflowing and need stricter rules like other non EU countries have.. but often people moan about specific immigrants from specific areas. . those people are, in my mind, racists and deserve to be shouted down. .  discussing the immigration figures as a whole without singling people of a certain country out is perfectly ok and sensible..

 

Many countries vet immigration requests for things like can they support themselves, work, start a business, add to the growth of a country.. those are the specifics I think we need to be looking at instead of having wide open boarders when we are almost at bursting point.. and I say this as the daughter of immigrants

 

Asylum seekers is a different matter and subject to different checks and balances... I'm not sure some of the voters even separate the two things though tbh  and the latter are often the ones that need the most help and support so are a drain on our resources. However if they need help to escape awful circumstances then we should continue to help if we can  

I appear to have made mistakes in pasting! it's difficult on a 'phone!
My favourite such quote is......
On being asked, what has my country done for me?
Harry Pearce: Educated you, provided you with opportunities to find employment, offered you financial assistance if you can't, looked after you when you were sick, ensured you were clothed, housed and fed, protected rather than persecuted you and allowed you to choose your own government. Actually, you're one of the luckier citizens of this planet.

Yup

Yes, a lot of their policies regarding women are worrying. Wasn't there talk of decriminalising rape within marriage too?

 

I agree with you on the 31% flat rate tax - great for those richer members of society, but could be crippling for already struggling low income people.

 

These are the policies people are voting for, but they haven't really been talked about. Someone said earlier that people only see one word with UKip 'immigration' but isn't that how they advertise themselves? I don't think I've ever heard Farage talk about a policy other than immigration in any sort of debate

The vetting process already exists for immigrants from non-EU countries, so it's not unreasonable to suggest it being put in place for EU member immigrants too

Well it is really if we do not get vetted when we travel to Europe.

Just looking at Wiki and a summary of UKIP poloicies.

 

Abolition of inheritance tax -

 

A voucher system to offset the cost of private treatments-

Matrons to run hospitals rather than managers, that policy could have leg.Or are Matrons cheaper than managers?

 

Repeal of the human rights act-

 

 

and it goes on...