That sounds familiar 

Same same as far as I'm concerned. 

Does it bother you then that we are expressing it?

I differ, but hey.........

No. As long as both points can be seen 

Jolly good, then I shall continue to speak without being told that you think you get it

I'm not gonna get into a huge debate but is there really any difference in whipping an animal against it's will with the possiblilty of death to perform for our entertainment..and possibly make a few pounds...and putting 2 dogs in a pit to fight....for our entertainment and possibly make a few pounds?

How about "performing" bears? Rip their teeth and claws out, hook them through the nose and beat them till they dance?

What about Dog breeders that have bred dogs that struggle to breath, to please animal loving customers?

I don't think I 'get it' I'm just putting my point of view 

Sorry but I appreciate that you're passionate about it but i don't see Horse Racing in the same league as this. Badger Baiting, Fox Hunting and cruelty to animals is illegal (rightly so) Horse Racing isn't - I'm sure we could debate until the cows come home but as someone said earlier - we all have an opinion on it and they're not all the same.

You know what I meant nuts

and Geordie, I think thats just as bad.

There's another thing. The animal isn't whipped to within an inch of it's life. The whip is waved back and forwards in it's eyeshot and any jockey that does use the whip too much is brought down on with a ton of bricks! 

Yeah, another point to grasp 

Or pets that don't get outdoors?

Or birds in a cage?

I find it really hard to understand that at the end of today there are 3 horses destroyed for our entertainment and a little thrill of a few pounds on a race *Ohh that really must get the old heart thumping*. And yet theres even an argument to have. 

I'm not naive enough to think everyone shares my opinion. The fact that it's legal doesn't make it right. Cruelty is cruelty no matter how you dress it up. Making a 3 hour programme about it once a year doesn't make it right. Buy a lottery ticket but don't bet on a horse winning and surviving a race

All animal abuse is wrong. Why humanity feels the need to abuse and exploit both humans and non humans just because they can is appalling.

I've heard plenty of interviews on 5live today from owners, jockeys, trainers and punters as well as the vet from the British Horseracing Board and some bigwig from Aintree all wringing their hands and expressing horror at what has happened today - all of them saying how much they all love the horses who were abused and exploited today.

Funny that. I love my family and friends as well as the numerous non humans that have shared our lives over the years and it wouldn't occur to me to cause them the kind of fear, pain and suffering that these animals were subjected to today - and then have the front to claim I loved them

• Synchronised - 9 years of age - fell, injured, & destroyed on 14 April 2012.
• According To Pete - 11 years of age - fell, injured, & destroyed on 14 April 2012.
• Gottany O's - 4 years of age - broke down injured & destroyed on 12 April 2012

On the course maybe. To train them they have to be whipped. They fear the whip and so when on the course they only have to see it to be scared and run. 

But there's the thing! I don't get excited when the National comes round. It's just another (admittedly high profile race) in the year. Although I do admit I do have a bet, but I don't jump up and down when the race comes on 

Not going outdoors isn't abuse. Birds in cages...well if they are shut in 24/7 then that's wrong. 

Like I said last night it's horrible when it happens 

How do you know that for sure? 

But they die throughout the year, its not just the national. I am talking about TODAY, as this is what the thread is about.

U B careful .. 28 March 2012 . Ludlow

Olivino  ....24th March

dont tell the wife... 19th march... southwell

etc... etc ...etc

So what... Is that just part and parcel of the good clean fun? regrettable but unavoidable?

I've watched programmes about it and I don't think the jockeys wave the whip in front of them for fun during the race. If there's no need for it why do they have it? 

Chance to make some quick money Gyspie  

You know, how many posts in this thread are National based only?   Go check out other race meetings too? 

Just remember how many thousands/millions that happens to, and the parrots allowed to walk flutter around the living room to please their owners.

The cats bred with hair that unless groomed by a human would end up in a knot....

No cat is gonna die from not being groomed 

Also a bird can live quite happily in a cage as long as it's fed, watered, loved, talked to and not beaten

Horses aren't beaten though and any one that is, their owners/trainers are in serious trouble! 

What really needs to happen is animals should not be kept as pets to amuse, console, or to be shown off by humans, or to race and win us money.....they should be free as we are.....

How many tears did you shed compared to the owner and stable staff.

We all die.

we dont all die for others entertainment or profit velvet.

and geordie, in essence, I agree with you.

See I read what you say then I think....have you REALLY looked into what goes on behind the scenes at horse races? Not just on the day but the years that build up to it? 

Today I shed no tears because I don't watch it. I bet the owner did cry. Lost an easy way to make money. Anyone who works in stables there IMO doesn't care about animal welfare. 

Yeah we do all die but would you like to die for someones elses entertainment? 

How do you know?.....have we bred the freedom of flight out of the winged creatures?

The horses are loved Gyps that's all I'm saying.

Why don't we ban futile wars instead of National Hunt.

Wonder how many labour voters are in here.