There must be some extreme inner pain someone has to go through to reach these levels, where you get to the point death is a blessed relief. Where no amount of therapy touches your surface. 

I don't know. Probably the latter. But she must have known she was flirting with oblivion. She wasn't stupid.

I don't mean some emotional reason to keep going - I mean some tough practical reason to keep going. To get your arse out of bed in the morning and keep going. No bones about it, my children saved my life. They don't know that - one day I will tell them. 

Different I know - she was an addict. I can't relate to that. I sound unsympathetic I know. I'll mellow  soon. Right now I'm cross. I keep thinking about my sister in law - she was just 3 when she found her father dead in the bath. He'd shot himself. 

My heart bleeds for her family. I know they love her very much. It's a shame all the love and support she had wasn't enough. So, so sad.

The thing is, when people like Amy who have used class A drugs long term, the amount taken keeps going up and up, as the buzz doesnt kick in, unfortunately this can can cause an overdose, which seems to have happened. It comes to a point when the body simply cant take anymore, its very likely she has had a heart attack. Its very sad

 More than likely. 

So so sad.She was ill,her addiction was her illness,some win their battle with it,some don't.God rest her she lost to her illness I hope she has finally found the peace she was looking for.

Brings back memories of Paula Yates who i miss so much too

I was waiting in the car for my daughter yesterday and 'rehab' came on wich made me think of her troubled life. I'm in total shock (even though maybe I shouldn't be). Crying, once again. Too much bad emotion over the past few weeks.

I won't say I'm surprised. But I am angry at the silly, stupid ****ing waste of such a formidable natural talent. Her poor, poor family. 

 

And well yes...we have all made mistakes. Believe me I've been so low death would have been a relief. 

 

It's hardly a question of support - if anyone had the support and the means to pay for support it was Amy Winehouse. But all that still didn't give her enough to live for. 

Yeah...  I pretty much feel like that too.    

Its not that I have no compassion..   I do think its terribly terribly sad..   its that utter feeling of frustration. ..

I have two cousins (brother & sister) who are chronic alcoholics..     I love em to bits, but I feel the same way about them..    anger, sadness, sympathy, frustration, helpnessness..    these are all the feelings you have when someone in your family is chronically addicted to something.

On my FB wall I have seen people saying that those around her should have helped her.    unfortunately there comes a time when nobody can help then..     It quite literally broke my Aunties heart to have to walk away from my cousin..   but that was the advise given..    "you have to let him reach rock bottom, and he has to want to try & get better"

He eventually did (not before doing irreversible damage to his body, I doubt he will see his 50th bday)...    My Uncle told me that during the time when they were staying away from him, he used to sneak round to my cousins flat & peek through the window, through the curtain..    and see him lying in his own filth & urine on the floor..   & he used to stay there willing him to breathe, knowing he couldn't leave til he saw he was breathing.   Then when he had established he was breathing, my Uncle told me he just used to sit down on the grass, under the windowsill & sob, in broad daylight.

Its really hard for me to imagine myself SO caught up in anything that I would inflict that kind of despair & pain on someone...    but, as it happens so often, I have to accept that I have never been that caught up in anything, so I fluxuate between accepting its out of their control, & thinking they just don't care enough about the people that love them!

I hope none of this gets misconstrued as me being heartless..   I'm not at all.    But when I think Amy dying..   its her parents that I grieve for.

I loved Paula

Originally Posted by Cariad:

I won't say I'm surprised. But I am angry at the silly, stupid ****ing waste of such a formidable natural talent. Her poor, poor family. 

 

And well yes...we have all made mistakes. Believe me I've been so low death would have been a relief. 

 

It's hardly a question of support - if anyone had the support and the means to pay for support it was Amy Winehouse. But all that still didn't give her enough to live for. 

Yeah...  I pretty much feel like that too.    

 

Its not that I have no compassion..   I do think its terribly terribly sad..   its that utter feeling of frustration. ..

 

 

 

 

 

I have two cousins (brother & sister) who are chronic alcoholics..     I love em to bits, but I feel the same way about them..    anger, sadness, sympathy, frustration, helpnessness..    these are all the feelings you have when someone in your family is chronically addicted to something.

 

On my FB wall I have seen people saying that those around her should have helped her.    unfortunately there comes a time when nobody can help then..     It quite literally broke my Aunties heart to have to walk away from my cousin..   but that was the advise given..    "you have to let him reach rock bottom, and he has to want to try & get better"

 

He eventually did (not before doing irreversible damage to his body, I doubt he will see his 50th bday)...    My Uncle told me that during the time when they were staying away from him, he used to sneak round to my cousins flat & peek through the window, through the curtain..    and see him lying in his own filth & urine on the floor..   & he used to stay there willing him to breathe, knowing he couldn't leave til he saw he was breathing.   Then when he had established he was breathing, my Uncle told me he just used to sit down on the grass, under the windowsill & sob, in broad daylight.

 

Its really hard for me to imagine myself SO caught up in anything that I would inflict that kind of despair & pain on someone...    but, as it happens so often, I have to accept that I have never been that caught up in anything, so I fluxuate between accepting its out of their control, & thinking they just don't care enough about the people that love them!

 

 

I hope none of this gets misconstrued as me being heartless..   I'm not at all.    But when I think Amy dying..   its her parents that I grieve for.

 

 

Even her Father knew she wasnt going to see her 30th birthday. Its the family you feel sorry for because they are left behind with the pain. Amy's pain is no more.

That film Leaving Las Vegas, with Nicholas Cage, showed how much he loved someone , but there was nothing he could do to stop it. It really helps you understand the pain and suffering and helplessness from both sides. A must watch if you can bear the sorrow. They have to reach rock bottom, unfortunately, some never get back up. 

The Genetics of addiction,some intresting reading on this link,it's an illness that. could happen to anyone or our children.

http://www.addictionsandrecove...iction-a-disease.htm

I agree there is a genetics to it..     for my younger cousin to see everything that happened with her brother, & then ten years down the line be in exactly the same situation...  

& yes, it is an illness

Ditty - that's so sad to read 

My uncle died from liver failure after being an alcoholic for over 10 years. Watching him slowly die was one of the most horrific things and not something I'd wish on anyone. The reason for his drinking was that his wife had an affair, left him, took the kids and told everyone that he beat her. All this because she wanted her new man. He never laid a finger on her...which she admitted years later...but the mud stuck and he was ostracised(sp). He was a footballer who only drank socially. Over time he became an empty shell of a man but NEVER stopped loving her. The day he died he asked if she was coming to see him. She never did. I know it was his choice to take that first drink but circumstances led him to take more and more to block out his pain. There was no way to make him stop. Not his kids, not his job (which he lost..along with his home), not his football. He told me in the hospital he wishes he'd never started but no matter how hard he tried the memories in his head destroyed him and he wanted to block them out.

 Cagney    thats so sad 

Oh thats made me a bit  

It shows how easy it is to become addicted to something. It's the reason I'll never judge someone for doing it. I don't know what went on behind closed doors with Amy Winehouse. I have no place to judge her. I feel for her family who are left behind and I hope she finds the peace in death she never had in life 

aw Cags!  That's awful.     I don't know how to word this, and I know this isn't the right way to word it but, he had a reason to drink, he drank to numb the pain....   though perversely it brought him more pain (losing his family)...    Its bloody hard though innit.

Thing with my cousins is...   there is no reason, no big bad in their lives..   The elder one had a fantastic job in the city..    a job that was held open for him for over 5 years when he was descending into his own personal hell.     My younger cousin, well yes, there was a broken relationship, but she came out of that with a child.   He'll be 8 now..   & he's gone through more than any child should because of her addiction. 

My feelings on it all are sooo conflicted..   I can be sad & angry all at the same time.     My Aunt & Uncle feel this but multiplied by 100.    They've aged so much over the past 20 years.   

(ontop of all this..   their third child.. the oldest, spent 10 of the years his younger brother was drinking heaviliy, in bed with ME, unable to stand up..     from aged 20 - 30!   He, thankfully is recovered now.

His brother (the alcoholic) is currently dry I think, but has been in & out of hospital ...  his kidneys are shot to bits, his liver is shot to bits, & he's had a stroke.    Dunno the current status of my other cousin, we were close once, but since she started drinking she doesn't want any contact with me or any of the wider family.

Yeah...    I can go along with that.    Tis true 

(bloody hell..    I nearly bad a right cock up there..    I posted the laughy smiley instead of the noddy one!   thank god I re-read before hitting post!) 

Ditty and Cagney - very sad to read what you've written 

The other point about addictive behaviour is that sometimes addicts actually enjoy taking what they're taking   it's hard to make sense of that but on occasions it's true.  My father was an alcoholic and even though his drinking led to pancreatic cancer, he said he loved the booze too much to ever give it up   he drank until the day he died.

You may think there's no reason Ditty but you don't live in that persons head. I don't mean that nasty but for those of us who don't have an addiction it's pretty hard to see ANYTHING bad enough to make us reach for a bottle or drugs. What's nothing to us can be the end of the world for someone else. I know when my dad died last year I hit the bottle. I never let it consume me though because I have 4 kids who depend on me. Not everyone has that reason to go on. Amy Winehouse may have had fame and fortune but who knows what was going on in her personal life and ultimately in her head. 

Sort of the same with my uncle Pengy. He was a great drunk. He was the life and soul and NEVER got weepy or sad with it. I think all that happened when he was alone the next morning....sober...hence having another drink 

I can understand that too. 

I smoke, and whilst I wished I didn't..    I actually still really enjoy smoking

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No..   and I know you're right..     I have this argument in my own head...    as I said.. I am conflicted. 

Its easier for me to accept this, when I am not looking at my Aunt & Uncle.  

To be honest, I started to drive myself round the bend with it all..    and got to a point where I had to stop looking for a reason, stop imagining what was going on in their heads, stop trying to come up with something that would help.    To a point, I try not to dwell on it all. 

You're right to stop looking for a reason. If you don't see one and they won't give you one then all you can do is be there for them. Nobody can make them stop apart from themselves. No amount of threats or promises will make them stop unless they want to....and unless the pain stops they won't want to. You can't take away people's memories or feelings so it's a battle that can't be won in some cases. It's not about strength. I don't see addicts as weak. I see them as making a foolish choice they can't turn back from. Who knows.....it could be any of us in the future 

My mums sister (my auntie Linda) had trouble with drugs 26 years ago... my Dad only told me this only 3 weeks ago. My mums side of the family is Danish and she was out in Copenhagen when she met an American. Got to know the wrong people and soon became a mess, family didn't know much about it but at one point she was critical but somehow survived. After that my Gran, Grandad and the whole family had to literally drag her into the clinic for rehab... she wouldn't go through it at all but apparently my Grandad went totally beserk and they made her go through with it. Soon after she first started she relaxed more and was fine with it.

Shes alive and well today... actually met her few years ago, its a big family in Denmark so I don't know every single one of them.

 Who knows.....it could be any of us in the future 

Or our kids!     Its one of my biggest fears..     now there is a terrifying thought.

Which brings me back round full circle to feeling desperately sorry for Amy's parents! 

As you said earlier.    "there but for the grace of god" n all that  (which, btw is the title of one of my all time fave backroom songs, by Fire Island)

 Pengy

Booze Rosie - curse of the Irish 

Are we still talking about poor Amy or have we drifted into personal scenarios?

It's just the way of threads on here nowadays Col    It sometimes helps peeps to 'talk' anonymously 

Whatever you want Cologne, i don't think anyone minds. 

Both Col.Amy's illness and death has probably touched the lives of many folk on a personal level,it is an illness that can indiscriminately come to all our doors.

I was incredibly sad when I heard this. her music was incredibly soulful and moving - sometimes it takes a tortured soul to write and perform this sort of stuff. So sad for her family .........I think a lot of people saw it coming but - no one can stop something like that - it really was down to her. So sad!

Yes i agree, it opens up doors of all types of addictions, and its nice we can discuss this in a civilised way 

I thought she was older as she seems to have been a daily feature in the tabloid media for so long, but I suppose she lived so fast and died so young.  Great for record/poster sales and the sex and drugs and rock and roll icon that was Amy Winehouse, but what a tragedy for anyone, regardless of her indisputable and unique talent!  With talent maybe comes unwanted personality attributes like a self-destructive mission and a notion that a great artist has to suffer for their art and become a Shakespearian-like tragic figure, like so many of the female artists that were her inspirations.  Maybe that's just marketing bullshit too!  I wonder how many hangers on bought into that whole Amy Winehouse legend/product and how many people around her were nudging her down that path of self destruction?

Ive not read the thread.

All I have to say on it is, how bloody sad...proper talent, I have seen people slate her today, and I dont get it....shes not a murderer, shes not a paedophile, the only person I think she hurt was herself, she got mixed up in a lot of wrongs, sadly Its a shame nobody came along in time to "save" her RIP Amy !

Skylark it's an illness like others than only can be overcome by the strongest and sadly as human nature dictates we're all not invincible , as in any illness it affects not just those who are ill.IMO as in no-one wakes and decides to become a victim of cancer no-one wakes and DECIDES  to become an addict.