reading that ^^^^   I have decided our boys would get on like a house on fire...   literally.   I don't think they'd be good for each other      I have visions of us waving PS3 controllers at them as they hoss it down the road to 'more exciting adventures'

Dotty, the dark side calls to all the kids. My Granddaughter is almost 14 and the usual suspects are yapping at her feet. So far she hasn't succumbed to them, but it's a mare.

My daughter is moaning that she can't stay on till she's 18   she informed me yesterday that she only has 12 weeks left at school  they will have to pick her up and throw her out and lock the gates when her last day comes  my dad reckons they will offer her the heads job

Do they not have 6th form there Aimee?

Karma . I'm now aged 54 ......................i got to age 27 and there was no stopping me ...........three kids aside. I got O levels - A levels ..............................much later GCSE Maths (which always terrified me) - I have two degrees and a PGCE but ....................I'm a stay at home grandma who looks after the kids! I know I should have done more with my life but ...................WTF! I love my kids, love my grandkids but still have an unquenchable thirst for knowledge - I go to French classes on Wednesday afternoons . i'll never stop wanting to learn 

That's covered Ditty, they'll have to be in Education or training.... they don't necessarily have to stay on at 'school'

Ref Issy


she's got onto the college course she wanted but the school she goes to has been great for her, i went to an awards ceremony last week and she got awards for sport but she also got one for attendence, she love's the place, she stays behind most nights for sports clubs and spent yesterday lunch time having a game of badminton with one of her sports teachers, she's really going too miss the place, she even goes in on the holidays to teach kids on the summer camps, at least it's kept her off the streets and caused me no trouble  i couldn't wait too get out of school at 3.30

Oh so its a bittersweet leaving then

BUT what is the betting she does exactly the same thing at her next place - she is clearly of that mindset xxx

You watch - she is a winner that girl of yours,,

That's what i keep telling her Issy but she's so sad too leave  you waytch out she'll be a star one day  she is too me anyway

Thank you for this Soops!!

I really need to find out more about this don't I?    

But that is good news!   thank you

Well  maybe  we have to radicalise...or do we sit here saying..."Oh Dear times are hard.." wrings hands..I would be on the streets If I  was student these days.."To the barricades ,,comrades!"

Mine are still a few years away from the College/Uni years but we're having the discussions about what they want to do with their lives now. High School this year and they need to start thinking about the future. They are lucky in the sense that I will pay all their tuition fees but there are rules to go with that. I don't want them coming out with debts hanging over them. Even if they don't HAVE to pay it back straight away I don't want them to have the attitude that it's not proper debt. It is IMO. The rules are.....get a job to pay rent, bills, food etc. Don't put in the effort and the hours and I pull them out and make them work for me. I don't want them to be drunk and lazing about for 3 years barely scraping together a few passes. On the other hand if they decide to skip Uni and go straight to work I'll support them in that too but without my rules  

I realise not every parent can do this for their kids and if this is the case it's a good thing to get help with fees but they should be paid back ASAP. Treated like a mortgage if you like. A set amount to be paid back each month not depending on how much they earn but the level of debt. It may encourage them to get out and look for work more. I have a friend who's son has just left Uni and is working 2 jobs to pay his off. One related to his degree and the other working in a supermarket at weekends.

Thats a great attitude to have Cagney. My two had to have jobs as well all the way through. Did them no harm at all.
We could not afford all the fees but we did pay for accommodation and also supplemented them.
But yes there are rules.

My eldest has got her uni debt and she just sees the payments as an extra tax if you like. Doesn't bother her at all cos it comes out at source.

I honestly don't see why students would want this debt hanging over them. It teaches them nothing about managing money properly. Surely the next step after Uni is to get a job, buy a house, maybe start a family. Wouldn't it be better to try and do all this with a clean slate? There's plenty of time for debt when you get a mortgage, buy a new car etc

I realise not every parent can do this for their kids and if this is the case it's a good thing to get help with fees but they should be paid back ASAP. Treated like a mortgage if you like. A set amount to be paid back each month not depending on how much they earn but the level of debt. It may encourage them to get out and look for work more. I have a friend who's son has just left Uni and is working 2 jobs to pay his off. One related to his degree and the other working in a supermarket at weekends.

But then we are going back to the days where students from poorer families cannot afford to go to Uni and I don't understand how that can be right.  It is incredibly difficult to get any sort of job at the minute and graduates are affected particularly badly therefore how are they expected to pay that debt back.  Most students don't need the encouragement to look for work - trust me it is impossible out there at the minute.

I honestly don't see why students would want this debt hanging over them

Most students don't want the debt but at the same time most students don't have parents who can afford to pay for it all up front.  And I take you back to my previous post about finding work as a graduate at the minute - not really that easy to pay it all back quickly.

Then can you not concede a teensy weensy bit that whacking on tuition fees on top of current student loans for maintenance will make a big dent to those students from poorer families. I see it like Issy, almost like a tax, a regressive tax that will affect those lower down the income scale.
I know it's not clear cut, and I can see where you are coming from PP. You are having to live within a budget, and say you are starting out from the lower rungs toward a career, but there will be many that don't just about make it. There will be many that wont be able to cope, and flourish.

Then can you not concede a teensy weensy bit that whacking on tuition fees on top of current student loans for maintenance will make a big dent to those students from poorer families. I see it like Issy, almost like a tax, a regressive tax that will affect those lower down the income scale.
I know it's not clear cut, and I can see where you are coming from PP. You are having to live within a budget, and say you are starting out from the lower rungs toward a career, but there will be many that don't just about make it. There will be many that wont be able to cope, and flourish.

It will affect those lower down the income scale far less than it does now - for starters the re-payment threshold will be incresed by £6,000 to £21,000 therefore those on lower income will not have to re-pay a penny and then when they do it is 9% of the amount above £21,000.  This system whilst charging more actually makes it easier for poorer people.  Like I say in a perfect world all education would be free but we don't live in that world and we hve to pay yes we would all love it if fees were decreased rather than increased but this new systems will not prevent people from going to University due to finance contrary to popular belief.

No it isn't a perfect world. But Scottish and Welsh students will have a few more quid in their pockets than the English. And individuals lucky enough to have the backing of firms like KPMG while they are undergraduates will not only walk in to cushy jobs, they'll have their tuition fees paid off for them too.
Doesn't sound like a level playing field to me.

quote:

But Scottish and Welsh students will have a few more quid in their pockets than the English

This is the bit that gets me cos its the English subsidising this.

No it isn't a perfect world. But Scottish and Welsh students will have a few more quid in their pockets than the English. And individuals lucky enough to have the backing of firms like KPMG while they are undergraduates will not only walk in to cushy jobs, they'll have their tuition fees paid off for them too.
Doesn't sound like a level playing field to me.

And how many undergraduates have the backing of KPMG whilst they are garduates - probably less that 1%.  I still don't understand why you believe poorer students will be worse off though.

Wrong. Scotland and Wales, like England, have seperate education budgets.

Maybe because those from poorer families, who haven't had help from ma and pa paying their fees, will be those who are hit the hardest? Then, once they're over the earnings threshold, they'll be paying it back for a much longer period, ('cos they owe more.) For some, that could amount to pretty much all of their working life, particularly those who are not big earners e.g. those who go to work in the public sector, schools, hospitals etc. At the same time, many will  be trying to buy a home and raise a family, where, the less you earn, the more every penny counts.

Wales and Scotland may have seperate education budgets but the money comes from ALL tax payers, not just Welsh and Scottish ones.

quote:

Maybe because those from poorer families, who haven't had help from ma and pa paying their fees, will be those who are hit the hardest?

When I was at uni, there was a threshold for paying fees... if your parents eared less than a certain amount you didn't have to contribute. If they earned between X and X you paid £1k, then it went up to £2k, then £3k.

Saz, when I was at Uni there were no tuition fees, but that was a veeeeeeeeeery long time ago

Yeah, that was 10 years ago now Dunno if its different now... I didn't have to pay fees though

Of course and it`s up to each individual "country" how they spend it. Scotland and Wales have abolished. England didn`t. That was up to them.

If you`re going down the road that England contributes more Croc. We could be here all day.

They took over the countries so its their responsibility now...

I have no objection to tuition fees and, if explained properly, the repayment scheme is actually fairer for students from poorer backgrounds and those who end up in lower paid jobs. Those suggesting that students should pay the debt off as soon as possible, may not be aware that they would be penalised for doing so, as that would otherwise be an advantage for richer students.

However,
1) this hike in tuition fees is ridiculously high and is merely filling a hole left by government cuts to University funding,
2) those from rich families can still pay all their fees upfront, and therefore never have the debt in the first place. Make all students take out the debt, if you want fairness.
3) the word 'debt' does put some people off and I feel a Graduate Tax could be just as fair, and do less harm, overall.

I look forward to relieving them of their responsiblities... 

Scotty

Any word its been a few hundred years now!!haha