Ian McCulloch. Was there ever a more obvious fall from grace? The Bunnymen one minute, Kylie Minogue and The Bangles the next 

Right I have been thinking about this....
Verdict...

You are all right about the lyrics and indeed I can see that Johnny Marr is a really good guitarist.
BUT I think I know what it is...

I cannot stand Morrissey's voice...

It is a moany droney mess.

So sadly that is probably why I never got them because his voice is an irritation and a turn off.

Sorry

I don't like Morriseys voice so I've never listened to the Smith, they might be good bur his voice isn't. One listens to what one finds appealing , his voice isn't and therefore they go down as crap in my book. For me, they can't be anything but. It's all personal, it's not pleasing to my ears so they, are as far as I'm concerned, can get slung on my musical no- no list along with U2, jimmy Hendrix, Pink Floyd and loads more that ae meant to be good but I just don't see it. That doesn't make me wrong btw, after all, one mans meat is another mans poison.

It got even worse for Ian Mac, he's with the Manics now!

Not getting on here as much as I would like has led to me nearly missing this very interesting Smiths' debate.

At the time I was not a Smiths fan, I really can't say why, could have been peer pressure, could have been other influences, just don't know. But as the band were probably 75% of the way through their recording life I suddenly became interested and started to listen to them more and more. So much so that I started buying albums and singles (vinyl), at one point buying a cardigan very similar to one Morrissey wore on stage.

Fast forward to 2011. I still love the work of the Smiths. Wished I had seen them live and have at least one of their songs "How Soon Is Now?" in my all time top 100. I would never catagorise myself as the most hardcore Smiths fan, but I own pretty much most of their output.

Now Morrissey as a solo artist is different. I was delighted when I first heard "Suedehead" which I think is a beautiful song. But from that point on I have lost interest in his work to the point that I can't name hardly any of it. What I heard just did not have the creativity and that special something which I felt listening to the Smiths. Could well be the partnership of Morrissey/Marr worked on a level that neither seem to have achieved since.

Music is something which I discuss with friends over lunch at least once a week. I am fortunate to have friends with diverse but often overlapping musical tastes. We don't always agree on things. I think I am a bit of a snob when it comes to music, I also think I am a bit of a hypocrite (I believe most of us are, that's why we can all name our guilty pleasures). I also think it is why I cannot understand people one one hand expressing their love for bands/artists like Take That, JLS, Cheryl Cole, almost all chart music and anything that comes out of programmes like the X-Factor. But on the other pulling down bands like the Smiths etc..

One thing I love about life is music. I love the diversity and the excitement of hearing something that you connect with for the very first time. I think one of life's pleasures is shopping for new music, browsing through racks, selecting your discs and heading home to spin them for the very first time.

I spend a lot of time exploring both old and new music. If I am honest I have never been a fan of the Beatles, but this year I have made it my goal to listen to their entire recorded output (except the two Beatles albums I own - no prizes for guessing them, but can you?).

I am currently listening to a significant amount of the recorded work of Keith Jarrett. I am exploring new bands in the areas of IDM, Ambient, Drone music, Glitch, Dark Ambient, Darkcore, Grime, Dubstep, EBM, Drum and Bass and Ambient Industrial.

On the other hand I also love Funk, Soul, Jazz, Reggae. I have an extensive collection of music from the 80's. I have albums by bands like Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd and Genesis and have even dipped my toe into Death Metal and purchased the music of Napalm Death and Bolt Thrower. Over christmas I have taken delivery of a significant number of soundtracks.

So just to round this brief comment on the Smiths off I thought I would list music currently on my iPod. Dues to using a high bit rate, I don't get a lot on!!


Boards of Canada (everything)
Mark Ronson Itnl - Bang Bang Bang (Single)
Ochre - Midsummer Nice Dream
The Clash - London Calling
TV on the Radio - Dear Science
Heaven 17 - Penthouse and Pavement (Deluxe Edition)
Human League - Travelogue
Human League - Reproduction
John Barry - (All his Bond Soundtracks)
A-Ha - 25
Hybrid - Disappear Here
Aphex Twin - Selected Works
The Hope Blister - Underarms and Sideways
Various Artists - FAX Compilation 1994
Sylvain Chauveau - Singular Forms (Sometimes Repeated)
The Passions - Thirty Thousand Feet Over China
Gary Numan/Tubeway Army - Replicas
The Chemical Brother - Further
Goldfrapp - Felt Mountain
Goldfrapp - Pilots (Single)
Goldfrapp - Seventh Tree


OK. Think I have earned myself a nice cup of tea and a biscuit...

Do you actually know anything about Take That?
They are a darn good pop band. They are not manfactured, They write their own music and have a huge fan base. This fan base is not just prepubescent girls - there are a lot of "grown ups" in there as well.

They should not be lumped in with the X factor wannabees, That is simply not fair.

I also think that music snobbery is the worse sort of snobbery.
I have expressed that I do not like the Smiths. I now know why - it is Morrisey's voice.
This does not make me somehow less of a music fan or a mindless so and so. I also can see how people do like them. As Carnelian said - you either get them or you don't
I love the Beatles and cannot understand how anyone who professes to love music can say they are not a fan.
I do not see what is wrong with darn good pop music. It doesn't always have to have a hidden meaning. Sometimes it can just be the beat, or the guitar or just the daft words.

Horses for courses really...

Reference Issy:

Do you actually know anything about Take That?
They are a darn good pop band. They are not manfactured, They write their own music and have a huge fan base. This fan base is not just prepubescent girls - there are a lot of "grown ups" in there as well.

They should not be lumped in with the X factor wannabees, That is simply not fair.

______________________________________________________________________

Hi Issy,

I do know a little bit about them, mainly due to the fact that some of my married friends now attend their concerts with their other half and it would seem that you are correct that they are not prepubescent girls (which I never thought they were) but more likely to be women in their 30's and 40's. It also means that I have heard their musical output principally because we discuss bands like Take That.

I thought they were manufactured. I am sure I remember seeing footage of them on TV being brought together. Something for me to research further I think.

I don't necessarily think that writing your own music and having a large fan base is any marker of quality. As you say they are a pop band. Personally I think that their output (excluding the cover versions) is not creatively strong, does not push any boundaries or have anything which separates it from the glut of bands both boy-band and X-Factor produced acts.

But then again I don't think their music is trying to push boundaries or say anything new. They have found a place and it works for them.

And I think that as I eluded to in my piece, each person takes from music what they want. I am not good at keeping my trap shut when I really dislike something.

For me Issy, the worst kind of snobbery is wine snobbery. But seriously, snobbery of any kind is not good.

I totally agree, I certainly don't think that music has to have any hidden meaning or clever lyrics. I also don't think lyrics have to make sense all the time.

I think your comment about not liking the Beatles, but professing to love music hits the nail on the head. You don't have to like everything. I think that's why I am going to listen to the Beatles back catalogue, because I am curious and always looking to learn more. If at the end I find I don't like the Beatles I will have good reasons why. I don't think many people can articulate just why so many people have such a high regard for their music.

I do think that when it comes to music, it is very hard to have strong opinions without actually having listened to the music itself.

They were to begin with way back in the 90s but I think that the stuff they produce now is far better. I can. I love so many of the words. I love the humour, I love the pathos. I love the way so many of their songs have reflected what is going on in my life. The simplicity of the lyrics astound me ,

I think that the key to good song writing or poetry is keeping it simple., That is the way to touch people's hearts. Trying to wrap emotion up in twisted lyrics will lose the audience. You may get people who think they know what it means, but that is not the same,

If a song has to be explained to someone, then it loses so much..

Issy,

Your post has given me some interesting thoughts about the conversation threads on here and your most recent post. I would like to expand on these, but I have to go now and I also have to do a bit of Beatles research to support my points.

I will post at a later date and if you are around to pick up and comment that would be good.
Anyways, have a good Sunday - what's left of it.

Same reasons many people love The Smiths ! 

I know what you mean about Morrissey's post-Smiths stuff.. something was lost .

For any The Smiths/Morrissey fans like me, Morrissey was interviewed by Dermot O'Leary on BBC Radio 2 this afternoon - you can listen again on I-Player.

 

I've still to listen to the whole thing but the bits I heard in the car were hilarious

ta! 

nice one x

O'Leary cannot handle Mozz - it's a classic interview- he's on top form

Dermot O Leary is overrated - he really is clueless.

I've always thought that too.

 

Morrissey pretty much takes the proverbial out of him

 

 

I HATED Dermot on BBLB - he used to make me cringe. He was so amateurish,

I will go and listen to the interview on a podcast I think

So did I - he's a terrible presenter and I often wonder why he is ever offered work.

 

I know you aren't a fan of Morrissey Issy but it's worth listening to the first 10 minutes or so at least to hear him mock O'Leary and the X Factor.

I am definitely going to. The fact that he took the mickey out of Dermot makes me warm to him

Meant to say in my first post - the interview is about an hour or so in to the show to save everyone having to listen to O'Leary for an hour longer than they have to.

That is considerate pf the beeb.