Thank you for your replies and concerns  All my close family are safe, although of course shocked and saddened that people they know have died, this following the coach crash in which some of my family knew the two victims really well and lived very close to where Bird lived.
I do know one of the victims if it's confirmed, not closely but I have had acquaintance with from time to time, I just hope the rumour is wrong  If it turns out to be false, it's still another victim for someone else's family and friends. I'm just so pleased my niece was 5 minutes later driving down that road, we just can't believe it's happened!

Dame, it's one of those things isn't it where you think oh it would never happen in my town but it just goes to show - it could happen anywhere at any time.


Those poor innocent people just going about their business and now they are gone.


Horrifying.

 

It truly is Miss S, never in a million years would I have thought anything like that would happen here. But when we think of Dunblane and Hungerford, I think they were small town too, it's hard to comprehend how someone could do something like this, yet it happens and thank god rarely in the UK.Yet once is just too many, as you say Miss S, horrifying.

Two weeks ago, I spent several hours in Whitehaven waiting for my mother having a minor op at the hospital and yesterday morning while she was having her stitches removed, I walked down Duke street many times that morning, I walked through the churchyard where I was christened. For some reason I can't get that day out of my head, never thinking two weeks on we would have this tragedy.

Dame, just wanted to say how sad this is for you and all of the people in Whitehaven and surrounding area, what a terrible, terrible thing to happen,so many people left grieving for their loved ones

Truly awful......

Thank you Super, it's just awful.  I think I will call it a night, it's really done my head in today. I have so many good memories of my younger years there, and my heart goes out the victims families and my friends and family who live in Whitehaven  

I have requested Crunchy Nuts' posting immediately before this posting to be removed as soon as possible as I do not feel it appropriate material when many people have lost loved ones in such a tragedy.
As it will take some time before the posting can be removed I would ask others just to ignore the posting rather than to respond to it - I have put it down to a lack of judgement caused by shock at what has happened.
(Edited 17.57 - Crunchy Nut's posting has now been deleted)

It appears that one of the victims is the twin brother of Derrick Bird.

I heard the same thing Yogi.

It seems to me he was entirely different with his friends than his family.

Amen...El Loro ....This is so tragic...people shot down going about their daily and inoffensive business. It becomes so real as the story unravels how devastating this must be to an entire community 

Yesterday, I'm absolutely certain that I read on the Times on line updates that he had a twin brother who was a policeman, then when I went back to look again it seemed to have disappeared, so maybe that accounts for it,,,,,,so so tragic for everyone affected by this, including his family

These things inevitably spark off black 'humour' El Loro, but I agree, particularly insensitive when Dame Ann was sharing her personal stuff re these awful events

Terrible tragedy my heart goes out to all those affected. Awful for you Dame Ann

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/10222188.stm

Terrible events.

I'm so relieved that you and your family are safe.  I was following this story on my travels and kept thinking, "We know someone up there!"

Thank you all for your concerns for my family, who are all safe  I did know the solicitor, in fact my ex sister-in-law worked for him for years and we have had family dealings with him in the past. I live about 15 mile from Whitehaven now, but obviously all my close family and many friends live there.

It is easy to see how he managed to evade being caught for the few hours he did, all the villages he went to after leaving Whitehaven are on minor roads, it would be hard to know which way he entered those villages without sightings or the trail of devastation he left behind him. The area he covered wasn't that big, because one village leads on to another.

Gun crime is just not heard of in this area, so the scale of this crime is devastating. Thanks once again for your concerns.

Dame Ann

i'll add to that for Dame Ann and anyone else who lives in the area, i know there are more FMs from around there

the poor sods were just going about their business, like that bloke who had just retired from Sellafield and had decided to go for a bike ride on a lovely sunny day - worked all his life and ...   its heartbreaking how many families lives have changed forever by just one morning of madness

My thoughts and sympathies are with the families of people who lost close ones yesterday and I am truly glad to hear that Dame Ann is ok, when I heard this awful news as it was being broken on the news yesterday, I said to my husband and niece that I was sure that there were FM's that lived nearby and hoped that they were ok.  We had gone out for the day and this is the first time I have been on the computer since.

It appears that from reports that a family feud sparked this terrible thing, reports are saying that his twin brother was the first person to be shot and as others have said, the family solicitor. 

Those poor people, just out for a normal, nice sunny day and this tragedy happens.

It really makes you wonder what makes a seemingly normal guy just flip like that. Everyone interviewed says he was just a run of the mill, average, non remarkable guy ....not an odd ball or anything. It really does make you wonder .........I doubt we'll ever know what was the trigger.

Here are the victim profiles. Be warned, reading about these people makes the entire situation that much more heartbreaking.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/10222161.stm
 

One report stated the guy that shot the poor folk was himself the victim of an attack by a fare in his cab who wouldn't pay,he was assaulted and lost some of his teeth.Looks like all sorts of things just accumulated and he blew.

One crumb of comfort is that of the 11 people hospitalised, 3 have now been discharged and the other 8 are in a stable or comfortable state - this includes the 3 who yesterday were described as being in a critical state.

The Cumbrian Community Foundation has issued the following statement on their Facebook page:

The trustees and staff offer their most sincere sympathy and condolences to the families and friends of the victims of yesterday's shootings and to everyone in the communities affected. We are currently giving careful consideration to whether it is appropriate to create a fund into which donations can be made. If anyone would like to make a donation could you please wait until information is available on our website?

The Foundation acts as a channel for assisting local Cumbrian charities and was involved with the flood recovery fund set up for the Cumbrian floods last November.

This is a link to their website.

Close family of Derrick Bird says there was no family feud going on.

I don't think gun crime of this magnitude is heard of in any area in this country to be honest.

My dad's mate was on duty for the Police yesterday. My dad hasn't spoke to him yet, but I'm sure it's a day at work that will stick in his mind forever.

This tragedy in such a beautiful community and surroundings is so hard to understand. That someone felt such rage and indifference to life he would not only target those he knew but those he randomly chose because of his growing impulse to kill again is so hard to imagine such a state of mind.


I heard the figures today of those who legally own guns and was quite shocked, hundreds of thousands. Why do so many people feel the need to own guns? what are they killing? and why? if it's animals are these people starving like those in 3rd world countries?????? don't think so. Guess we'll never know how many illegally hold guns but they obviously don't have them for a "good" reason. Thank God the UK isn't as bad as the US where their constitution states it's the right for everyone to bear arms....no wonder they have so many murders which is so sad for their country and those who die by the gun and their families who suffer the consequences.

Just wanted to touch on this real quick. Not everybody that owns a gun does so with the intention of hunting animals. I would say that a sizeable majority of shotgun owners (for sport) shoot nothing but clays. It is a very enjoyable sport/hobby.

Clay shooting I can totally accept, the shooting of wildlife I just can't if that's what some have bought guns for.

If someone wishes to own a gun for sport then I don't see any reason why they shouldn't be able to do so.  After all shooting is an olympic sport.

However, other than farmers, I see no reason why anyone else should need to own one.  Those current non-farmer owners who own one just for shooting the odd rabbit/rat/vermin seems rather pointless to me.

If a gun is owned for sport then that person should be obligated to belong to a registered gun club along with the current legislation. (This actually may be the law already I'm not that well versed in the current gun laws)

I'm never quite sure whether monetary donations are really appropriate in cases like this. I know it's an incredibly horrific and dreadful thing to happen but .........any young father, elderly mother, much loved family member could be run over or taken out in a dreadful accident tomorrow. I really don't see why appeals are set up in cases like this. Perhaps I'm being a bit harsh but .........any accidental death has tragic implications for the family involved - just because one 'accident' is more notorious how does shed loads of money make a difference?

I am inclined to agree Soozywoo.  I felt the same when monetary donations flooded in after Princess Diana died. 

There has been no fund appeal for the recent victims in Bradford.  And there will have been many murders this week which have attracted little or no press attention at all.

soozy these were not 'accidents', these poor people were murdered

That is why the Cumbrian Community Foundation said that it was considering if it was appropriate. I think they made an announcement quickly so that if any appeal was to be considered needed that it could be properly organised and targeted where most appropriate.

I think there is a big difference between this tragedy where many different families have been affected - families of the victims, but also the emergency services, those who witnessed the shootings, those in the local community who knew/know the victims - some of these may face financial hardship, others less so - and Diana's accident where there would have been no possibility of financial hardship.

Another taxi driver who knew Bird has said that Bird had told him that the Inland Revenue had discovered that he had £60,000 in his bank account which hadn't been declared - he was fearing that he would be jailed.

Although Bird was self-employed and therefore would have had to file tax returns, I don't know if he had an accountant to do his accounts for him. If he had, the accountant would have been able to tell him that the Revenue would only send people in the most serious of cases, generally where the taxpayer was refusing to co-operate or commiting very serious fraud. It's not in the interest of the Revenue to send taxpayers to prison for the simple reason that whilst they are in prison they can't be earning any money so can't make the money to pay the tax. I am an accountant and I know how these things work.

The Cumbria Community Foundation have, after consideration as to whether it was appropriate, set up the Cumbria Comunity Memorial Fund. This is a link to their site announcing this fund

.