No. His main residence is still in England. Apparently he's requested planning permission for a ÂĢ20,000 garden shed.
quote:Originally posted by Daniel J*:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
after a complete and utter failure of capitalism.
You say that quite a lot.
That's because I enjoyed it the first time I said it and thus said it again.
Perhaps I should revert to my "ameliorating the defects of capitalism" material.
At the same time could I point out that if the C word is ticking along like normal, why are people calling for Cameron to take over
Does he have a different and more successful capitalism?
quote:Originally posted by Daniel J*:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
after a complete and utter failure of capitalism.
You say that quite a lot. Perhaps things have changed in the Top Right since I was made redundant from my job, along with the rest of the site, but for most parts of the country capitalism is ticking along like normal. We've had a crisis in the banking utility sector here, largely due to poor regulation by Gordon Brown and the interconnectedness of global economies, but capitalism itself still has its legs. We're going to have to pay for that crisis too but not, I suspect, with a revolution, just some rioting on the streets in some areas. Capitalism, as it is at the moment, contains the seeds of its own destruction but it's a hardy variety and those seeds have yet to flower. Most importantly, most workers have bought into it lock, stock, and barrel. In their heads. They're not going to go back to feudalism, or on to communism, or on to anarchy without a fight. We may have a false consciousness but we're too dissimilar now to develop a class consciousness.
This post is almost entirely content free, and seems to consist of little else but sloganeering that is designed to obfsucate rather than enlighten. Mao or Lenin would have been proud of this post for its vacuity yet appearance of forthright content.
Nah, he's got a townhouse in one of the London Squares near where my son lives at Marble Arch.
I don't think he's there much though
I don't think he's there much though
quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
At the same time could I point out that if the C word is ticking along like normal, why are people calling for Cameron to take over
Nu capitalism I expect!
Sam old shite though whatever they call it
quote:Originally posted by Daniel J*:
The demise of the Labour Party was inevitable. It was unelectable until Blair ditched socialism for his strange mix of market economics and social communitarianism. Brown has kept the economics for the obvious reasons and shifted more towards a social culture of dependency masquerading as social justice and using the middle classes as his wallet. Socialism in the Marx sense is flawed anyway as it profoundly misunderstands human nature. Socialism as the base of communism is demonstrably unworkable. Socialism as some some sort of 1970s working class paradigm died a natural death years ago except in the mind of some dinosaurs like Scargill and Benn.
Spot on in this and in your other posts on this thread.
quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
So Danjay. Do you think that the usual grumpy moaning suspects on here would prefer a return to the left wing style of Eden, MacMillan, Wilson, Callaghan etc. Would they prefer to take even more power away from government and let the evil capitalists run the lot? Or something else? I can't work it out.
There's nothing wrong with capitalism. It's greed that's at fault and that's what's wrong with NuLabour, too - greed. The other thing that's wrong with them is their totalitarian nature disguised as "caring".
quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
I suspect that I am older and more rural than you. This area seemed to be better off in the sixties and seventies than now.
I think that industry had a major effect. Real career type work brought cash and familial and community stability. Most of the industries were interlinking and dependant on coal. Once the coal went, the rest followed. We are in a mess.
They thieved all the money out of this area and diverted it to London, and then who knows where? I don't think that anybody, not even HMRC knows where it all is.
What I would like is something constructive, a group of academics to study and recommend, and a government strong enough to back them up. Otherwise we leave all the decisions to a bunch of businessmen and crooks, and their daft market forces.
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
quote:Originally posted by Flossie:quote:Originally posted by Daniel J*:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
after a complete and utter failure of capitalism.
You say that quite a lot. Perhaps things have changed in the Top Right since I was made redundant from my job, along with the rest of the site, but for most parts of the country capitalism is ticking along like normal. We've had a crisis in the banking utility sector here, largely due to poor regulation by Gordon Brown and the interconnectedness of global economies, but capitalism itself still has its legs. We're going to have to pay for that crisis too but not, I suspect, with a revolution, just some rioting on the streets in some areas. Capitalism, as it is at the moment, contains the seeds of its own destruction but it's a hardy variety and those seeds have yet to flower. Most importantly, most workers have bought into it lock, stock, and barrel. In their heads. They're not going to go back to feudalism, or on to communism, or on to anarchy without a fight. We may have a false consciousness but we're too dissimilar now to develop a class consciousness.
This post is almost entirely content free, and seems to consist of little else but sloganeering that is designed to obfsucate rather than enlighten. Mao or Lenin would have been proud of this post for its vacuity yet appearance of forthright content.
Presumably you are talking about your own reply and not Daniel's post?
quote:Socialism as some some sort of 1970s working class paradigm died a natural death years ago except in the mind of some dinosaurs like Scargill and Benn
JennyWren
Scargill and Benn are two of my heroes. Long live king Arthur and Lord Tony.quote:Originally posted by Flossie:
This post is almost entirely content free, and seems to consist of little else but sloganeering that is designed to obfsucate rather than enlighten. Mao or Lenin would have been proud of this post for its vacuity yet appearance of forthright content.
This post contains a thumbs-up.
quote:Originally posted by jennywren:
There's nothing wrong with capitalism. It's greed that's at fault and that's what's wrong with NuLabour, too - greed. The other thing that's wrong with them is their totalitarian nature disguised as "caring".
Well said Jenny
quote:Originally posted by jennywren:
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah but there is the hidden cost too isn't there? We say that our coal is too expensive to extract so we will import cheap coal from, say, Poland. Then we fling our people on the dole, so the expense of that has to be taken into account. Cheap coal from abroad suddenly doesn't look so cheap. Not to mention the human cost of people flung on the scrap heap and we are seeing this cascade down the generations today too. Generations relying on benefits. Not a good way to go.
quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
I suspect that I am older and more rural than you. This area seemed to be better off in the sixties and seventies than now.
I think that industry had a major effect. Real career type work brought cash and familial and community stability. Most of the industries were interlinking and dependant on coal. Once the coal went, the rest followed. We are in a mess.
They thieved all the money out of this area and diverted it to London, and then who knows where? I don't think that anybody, not even HMRC knows where it all is.
What I would like is something constructive, a group of academics to study and recommend, and a government strong enough to back them up. Otherwise we leave all the decisions to a bunch of businessmen and crooks, and their daft market forces.
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah well! Wait until later on when the Russians start shutting your gas off.
Ironically the Russians have turned out to be better at Capitalism than Brown, Blair, or Thatcher.
quote:Originally posted by squiggle:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah but there is the hidden cost too isn't there? We say that our coal is too expensive to extract so we will import cheap coal from, say, Poland. Then we fling our people on the dole, so the expense of that has to be taken into account. Cheap coal from abroad suddenly doesn't look so cheap. Not to mention the human cost of people flung on the scrap heap and we are seeing this cascade down the generations today too. Generations relying on benefits. Not a good way to go.
Exactly. There's more than one way of looking at a political situtation, and it was short-sighted of Margaret Thatcher to just lay into the unions and the manufacturing industry without considering both the short-term and long-term effects on the country.
quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
I suspect that I am older and more rural than you. This area seemed to be better off in the sixties and seventies than now.
I think that industry had a major effect. Real career type work brought cash and familial and community stability. Most of the industries were interlinking and dependant on coal. Once the coal went, the rest followed. We are in a mess.
They thieved all the money out of this area and diverted it to London, and then who knows where? I don't think that anybody, not even HMRC knows where it all is.
What I would like is something constructive, a group of academics to study and recommend, and a government strong enough to back them up. Otherwise we leave all the decisions to a bunch of businessmen and crooks, and their daft market forces.
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah well! Wait until later on when the Russians start shutting your gas off.
Ironically the Russians have turned out to be better at Capitalism than Brown, Blair, or Thatcher.
And the Chinese are better still. Trouble is, they have so many dollars on reserve, they don't know what to do with them, particularly if the dollar crashes, which is a possibility.
As I said to Squiggle, Mrs Thatcher was very short-sighted to lay into the unions without thinking of the consequences.
Now, as you say, we are dangling on the whim of Russia. Very, very dangerous.
quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by squiggle:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah but there is the hidden cost too isn't there? We say that our coal is too expensive to extract so we will import cheap coal from, say, Poland. Then we fling our people on the dole, so the expense of that has to be taken into account. Cheap coal from abroad suddenly doesn't look so cheap. Not to mention the human cost of people flung on the scrap heap and we are seeing this cascade down the generations today too. Generations relying on benefits. Not a good way to go.
Exactly. There's more than one way of looking at a political situtation, and it was short-sighted of Margaret Thatcher to just lay into the unions and the manufacturing industry without considering both the short-term and long-term effects on the country.
The downside of that though is that the unions were attempting to dictate policy to government so something had to be done.
quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
I suspect that I am older and more rural than you. This area seemed to be better off in the sixties and seventies than now.
I think that industry had a major effect. Real career type work brought cash and familial and community stability. Most of the industries were interlinking and dependant on coal. Once the coal went, the rest followed. We are in a mess.
They thieved all the money out of this area and diverted it to London, and then who knows where? I don't think that anybody, not even HMRC knows where it all is.
What I would like is something constructive, a group of academics to study and recommend, and a government strong enough to back them up. Otherwise we leave all the decisions to a bunch of businessmen and crooks, and their daft market forces.
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah well! Wait until later on when the Russians start shutting your gas off.
Ironically the Russians have turned out to be better at Capitalism than Brown, Blair, or Thatcher.
And the Chinese are better still. Trouble is, they have so many dollars on reserve, they don't know what to do with them, particularly if the dollar crashes, which is a possibility.
As I said to Squiggle, Mrs Thatcher was very short-sighted to lay into the unions without thinking of the consequences.
Now, as you say, we are dangling on the whim of Russia. Very, very dangerous.
But the reason that we ARE in such a dangerous position is that first of all not enough power stations have been commissioned and our energy companies have been sold to mainly French and German companies. Very very shortsighted policies both of them. The windfarm brigade certainly bear some responsibility for this state of affairs.
quote:Originally posted by squiggle:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:quote:Originally posted by jennywren:quote:Originally posted by Garage Joe:
I suspect that I am older and more rural than you. This area seemed to be better off in the sixties and seventies than now.
I think that industry had a major effect. Real career type work brought cash and familial and community stability. Most of the industries were interlinking and dependant on coal. Once the coal went, the rest followed. We are in a mess.
They thieved all the money out of this area and diverted it to London, and then who knows where? I don't think that anybody, not even HMRC knows where it all is.
What I would like is something constructive, a group of academics to study and recommend, and a government strong enough to back them up. Otherwise we leave all the decisions to a bunch of businessmen and crooks, and their daft market forces.
The problem with coal, is that it got overly-expensive to extract. The country simply couldn't afford it and that was the beginning of the end.
Ah well! Wait until later on when the Russians start shutting your gas off.
Ironically the Russians have turned out to be better at Capitalism than Brown, Blair, or Thatcher.
And the Chinese are better still. Trouble is, they have so many dollars on reserve, they don't know what to do with them, particularly if the dollar crashes, which is a possibility.
As I said to Squiggle, Mrs Thatcher was very short-sighted to lay into the unions without thinking of the consequences.
Now, as you say, we are dangling on the whim of Russia. Very, very dangerous.
But the reason that we ARE in such a dangerous position is that first of all not enough power stations have been commissioned and our energy companies have been sold to mainly French and German companies. Very very shortsighted policies both of them. The windfarm brigade certainly bear some responsibility for this state of affairs.
And, surprisingly, the Greenham Commen Women, of which my mother was one.
No more nuclear power stations. No more coal. How are we supposed to power our computers, eh?
I'm not sure that the good women of Greenham Common were protesting about Nuclear power (although give them the chance!) Twas more to do with Cruise Missiles.
: pedantic :
: pedantic :