quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:
In the case of the Lockerbie bomber I do not think he should be released. But he will be as Alex Salmond will want to prove he is a big man on the world stage.
This debacle is purely political and at no point will justice come into the equation.

quote:

Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:
In the case of the Lockerbie bomber I do not think he should be released. But he will be as Alex Salmond will want to prove he is a big man on the world stage.
This debacle is purely political and at no point will justice come into the equation.

Hi Luxor,

There's also an argument that the conviction was purely political and that justice didn't come into the equation there either when Al-megrahi was offered up by Qaddafi as the perpetrator..

Jim Swire, father of one of the victims, and a guy who continues to try to find the full facts of what happened, isn't convinced of his guilt

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

prison is a punishment...how can you reform some 20 yr old who sits playing ps games in his cell 23 hours a day.

quote:

Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:
In the case of the Lockerbie bomber I do not think he should be released. But he will be as Alex Salmond will want to prove he is a big man on the world stage.
This debacle is purely political and at no point will justice come into the equation.

Hi Luxor,

There's also an argument that the conviction was purely political and that justice didn't come into the equation there either when Al-megrahi was offered up by Qaddafi as the perpetrator..

Jim Swire, father of one of the victims, and a guy who continues to try to find the full facts of what happened, isn't convinced of his guilt

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

prison is a punishment...how can you reform some 20 yr old who sits playing ps games in his cell 23 hours a day.

How can you punish someone who is never going to be let out. Short term is to reform long term is to protect the public. If it was to punish we would have the old hard labour days back. Or we would get out the old medieval instruments of fun.

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:

quote:

Originally posted by Slinkiwitchx:

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:
In the case of the Lockerbie bomber I do not think he should be released. But he will be as Alex Salmond will want to prove he is a big man on the world stage.
This debacle is purely political and at no point will justice come into the equation.

Hi Luxor,

There's also an argument that the conviction was purely political and that justice didn't come into the equation there either when Al-megrahi was offered up by Qaddafi as the perpetrator..

Jim Swire, father of one of the victims, and a guy who continues to try to find the full facts of what happened, isn't convinced of his guilt

Good day to you.
The act itself was a political crime. Who all was involved we will probably never know. However, with the limited knowledge that we, the public, have been told and of course the high court judges he is guilty.
If there is other evidence suggesting otherwise then that is a different matter he should not be in prison ill or not.
But unti evidence is put before a court of law then he must remain in jail.
As for Jim Swire, his is not the only voice that should be heard. He was only one of the people who lost a loved one, there are hundreds of others.

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

prison is a punishment...how can you reform some 20 yr old who sits playing ps games in his cell 23 hours a day.

How can you punish someone who is never going to be let out. Short term is to reform long term is to protect the public. If it was to punish we would have the old hard labour days back. Or we would get out the old medieval instruments of fun.

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

prison is a punishment...how can you reform some 20 yr old who sits playing ps games in his cell 23 hours a day.

How can you punish someone who is never going to be let out. Short term is to reform long term is to protect the public. If it was to punish we would have the old hard labour days back. Or we would get out the old medieval instruments of fun.

never being let out is the punishment.

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Fan of the girls:

quote:

Originally posted by CaptVimes:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

but what about all the victims of their crimes and the deaths they suffered - particularly in the case of the Lockerbie bomber??

Its highly unlikely he is one of the bombers. The whole case is an embarrassment to our justice system.

The whole point of prison is to reform or protect society from them. If they are about to die then neither apply anymore.

Personally I dont think they should have let Biggs back into the country knowing he was ill anyway but thats another topic.

prison is a punishment...how can you reform some 20 yr old who sits playing ps games in his cell 23 hours a day.

How can you punish someone who is never going to be let out. Short term is to reform long term is to protect the public. If it was to punish we would have the old hard labour days back. Or we would get out the old medieval instruments of fun.

short term to reform..omg...lol...


THEY CALL IT A 6 MONTHS LIE DOWN UP THIS WAY.

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

quote:

Originally posted by charmer:

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

that smilie always makes me chuckle

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

I love that.

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:
Although all this popcorn-scoffing seems to have killed off the thread

quote:

Originally posted by shirehorse:
Tricky one that. Personally I think yes. Beacuse a) they're very unilkely to be a danger to the public and b) if society leaves them to die in agonising pain in prison, it says something pretty awful about society.

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

quote:

Originally posted by luxor:

quote:

Originally posted by Demantoid:

I love that.

Although all this popcorn-scoffing seems to have killed off the thread

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:
I don't think any of us can actually sit here and say he is or isn't guilty but he has been found guilty in the eyes of the law!!

Anyway that is beside the point in this thread the question I am asking is should a prisoner who has beeen found guilty of a crime ever be let out on compassionate grounds??

quote:

Originally posted by The Devil In Diamante:

quote:

Originally posted by Pretty_P:
I don't think any of us can actually sit here and say he is or isn't guilty but he has been found guilty in the eyes of the law!!

Anyway that is beside the point in this thread the question I am asking is should a prisoner who has beeen found guilty of a crime ever be let out on compassionate grounds??

PP, tricky one..

In the case of the Lockerbie Bomber presuming he is guilty as convicted (just put aside that he might be innocent for now), no...he should rot IMO....IF he is a terrorist, what's to say he won't mastermind something else once back in Libya? I know he is very ill, but who knows....

In the case of Ronnie Biggs, well, he has enjoyed his life and come home for the Healthcare now he is a free Man and at least that will mean it is costing the Taxpayer less to keep him and I really don't think he poses a threat to the public.

Also, Ronnie Biggs commit a crime against the establishment involving money, which seems to carry a heavier sentence than murder, rape (think Baby P)...the whole system needs an overhaul, and criminal SHOULD serve the sentence in full, not getting out after only serving a third and all that guff....